[PC-NCSG] Fwd: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
Mary.Wong at law.unh.edu
Mary.Wong
Tue Feb 12 01:14:38 EET 2013
Yeah, I was just worried that CSG would get all technical and semantic
with us when the time comes next year, since he used the word
"privilege" and not "right", and made no mention of any other potential
candidate. I think rewording it to make it clear that this is not the
understanding - especially if your email indicates what the
understanding seems to be instead - would be a good thing. That way, if
they disagree with the interpretation, may as well have that out now in
front of Chris LaHatte rather than wait a year for the inevitable ....
Cheers
Mary
Mary W S Wong
Professor of Law
Director, Franklin Pierce Center for IP
Chair, Graduate IP Programs
UNIVERSITY OF NEW HAMPSHIRE SCHOOL OF LAW
Two White Street
Concord, NH 03301
USA
Email: mary.wong at law.unh.edu
Phone: 1-603-513-5143
Webpage: http://www.law.unh.edu/marywong/index.php
Selected writings available on the Social Science Research Network
(SSRN) at: http://ssrn.com/author=437584
>>>
From:
Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org>
To:
<Mary.Wong at law.unh.edu>
CC:
"NCSG-Policy" <PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
Date:
2/11/2013 6:06 PM
Subject:
Re: [PC-NCSG] Fwd: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
I see your concern, Mary. Thanks. Steve's a slippery one. What if we
re-worded point 2 as follows?:
"2. NCSG is entitled to put forward the initial sole candidate for the
following year (2013-14). This candidate would have to get 8 votes to be
selected."
It is currently:
"2. NCSG will have the privilege to put forward a candidate for
the following year (2013-14). This candidate would have to get 8 votes
to be selected."
Would that fix the possible difference in interpretation?
Thanks again,
Robin
On Feb 11, 2013, at 2:57 PM, <Mary.Wong at law.unh.edu> wrote:
Thanks, Robin - and thanks for shepherding this whole thing through
this long-drawn out process. Just one question - does Steve M's email
stating that NCSG will have the "privilege" of putting up a candidate
next year mean that there is NO agreement on rotation, i.e. that CSG may
well also put up its own candidate, in which case there'll be a
contested election and the winner will need 8 votes?
Cheers
Mary
Mary W S Wong
Professor of Law
Director, Franklin Pierce Center for IP
Chair, Graduate IP Programs
UNIVERSITY OF NEW HAMPSHIRE SCHOOL OF LAW
Two White Street
Concord, NH 03301
USA
Email: mary.wong at law.unh.edu
Phone: 1-603-513-5143
Webpage: http://www.law.unh.edu/marywong/index.php
Selected writings available on the Social Science Research Network
(SSRN) at: http://ssrn.com/author=437584
>>>
From:
Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org>
To:
NCSG-Policy <PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
Date:
2/10/2013 11:31 PM
Subject:
[PC-NCSG] Fwd: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
FYI
Begin forwarded message:
From: Chris LaHatte <chris.lahatte at icann.org>
Date: February 9, 2013 10:28:15 PM PST
To: Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org>, "Metalitz, Steven"
<met at msk.com>
Cc: Avri Doria <avri at acm.org>, Tony Holmes
<tonyarholmes at btinternet.com>, Marilyn Cade <marilynscade at hotmail.com>,
Kristina Rosette <krosette at cov.com>, "Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com)"
<wendy at seltzer.com>, Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
<wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de>
Subject: RE: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
And I confirm I am happy to facilitate such discussions
Regards
Chris LaHatte
Ombudsman
Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
Confidentiality
All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff
or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in
order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall
take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board
members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant,
they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information,
except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint
From: Robin Gross [mailto:robin at ipjustice.org]
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2013 11:07 AM
To: Metalitz, Steven
Cc: Chris LaHatte; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
Thank you Steve. Yes, we can agree to this process to move us forward
with the issue of a Vice Chair for our house. The only additional
request is that we'd like for the ombudsman to participate in the
negotiations to set the procedures for 2014 (point 3 below).
Thanks again,
Robin
On Feb 5, 2013, at 11:10 AM, Metalitz, Steven wrote:
Dear Chris,
Thank you again for facilitating our brief but productive meeting last
week in Los Angeles.
I can now confirm that the CSG can support the following approach which
emerged from the meeting:
1. Wolf-Ulrich Knoben will continue as vice chair until the 2013
annual meeting (Buenos Aires). There will be no election.
2. NCSG will have the privilege to put forward a candidate for
the following year (2013-14). This candidate would have to get 8 votes
to be selected.
3. We will meet as a house no later than the London (mid-2014)
meeting to set the procedures that would apply for the term following
the 2014 annual meeting (and perhaps beyond).
(When we met in LA I was under the impression that the second meeting
of CY 2014 was in Singapore. It seems ? though the ICANN announcement
is not explicit ? that it will be in London. In any case, the reference
in point 3 is to the second meeting of CY 2014 as the outside date for
this discussion.)
If the NCSG representatives can confirm their SG?s approval of this
approach, then I believe we can put this matter behind us.
Thanks again to all for your respective roles in reaching this
conclusion.
Steve Metalitz
From: Chris LaHatte [mailto:chris.lahatte at icann.org]
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 4:26 PM
To: Metalitz, Steven
Cc: Robin Gross; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
Subject: RE: Vice Chair Position
I am on my way
Chris LaHatte
Ombudsman
Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
Confidentiality
All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff
or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in
order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall
take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board
members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant,
they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information,
except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint
From: Metalitz, Steven [mailto:met at msk.com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 1:23 PM
To: Chris LaHatte
Cc: Robin Gross; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position
Mockapetris room is available. Shall we convene there?
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 30, 2013, at 12:14 PM, "Chris LaHatte" <chris.lahatte at icann.org>
wrote:
I am in room 412 which is a bit small-depending on who can make it
here-It could fit about 6-7 at the most
Chris LaHatte
Ombudsman
Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
Confidentiality
All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff
or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in
order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall
take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board
members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant,
they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information,
except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint
From: Metalitz, Steven [mailto:met at msk.com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 11:48 AM
To: Chris LaHatte
Cc: Robin Gross; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position
So about 1:30?
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 30, 2013, at 11:41 AM, "Chris LaHatte" <chris.lahatte at icann.org>
wrote:
I can meet at lunch-we will need to find somewhere, but I am sure we
can
Chris LaHatte
Ombudsman
Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
Confidentiality
All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff
or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in
order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall
take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board
members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant,
they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information,
except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint
From: Robin Gross [mailto:robin at ipjustice.org]
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 11:38 AM
To: Chris LaHatte
Cc: Steven Metalitz; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position
Thanks, Chris and Steve. How about a chat after the CEO speaks during
lunch?
Robin
On Jan 30, 2013, at 11:14 AM, Chris LaHatte wrote:
Thanks for this. I have seen at least some of the exchanges. I am
available except for a meeting at 3 today for about an hour, and
tomorrow at 10, and at 1 to 3.45 tomorrow for a meeting with the board.
I can meet early morning late evening-whenever suits.
Can I encapsulate the issue as to
1. Was the agreement to rotate the nomination a long term
agreement or one off only?
2. Is there any reason why, if it was one off only, why you could
not agree to let the nomination proceed?
By use of the term ?you? I mean both constituencies.
Regards
Chris LaHatte
Ombudsman
Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
Confidentiality
All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff
or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in
order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall
take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board
members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant,
they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information,
except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint
From: Metalitz, Steven [mailto:met at msk.com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 11:07 AM
To: Chris LaHatte; Robin Gross
Cc: Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina Rosette; Wendy
Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com)
Subject: RE: Vice Chair Position
Chris,
CSG remains glad to speak with you and with NCSG and welcomes your
efforts to resolve this. Perhaps we could find a few minutes this
afternoon (I note the slot from 1:30 to 3 includes the possibility of
break out sessions.
We disagree with the characterizations below on factual grounds. As
you already have the documentation on what the agreement and where
things now stand, I won?t repeat it here. Glad to focus on solutions
going forward.
Steve Metalitz, IPC
From: Chris LaHatte [mailto:chris.lahatte at icann.org]
Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 8:26 PM
To: Robin Gross
Cc: Avri Doria; Metalitz, Steven; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com)
Subject: RE: Vice Chair Position
I am available to talk and perhaps discuss matters separately or
together. I just bumped into Marilyn Cade who does want to talk, so
perhaps something can be done
Regards
Chris LaHatte
Ombudsman
Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
Confidentiality
All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff
or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in
order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall
take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board
members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant,
they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information,
except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint
From: Robin Gross [mailto:robin at ipjustice.org]
Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 5:21 PM
To: Chris LaHatte
Cc: Avri Doria; Steven Metalitz; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com)
Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position
Dear Chris,
I would definitely like to resolve this situation this week in LA while
we are here. However, we thought we had come to an agreement to rotate
turns nominating VC candidates, and if the CSG is not willing to honor
that agreement we wonder how useful it would be to try to reach a "new"
agreement with them. Since their VC continues on indefinitely, as long
as they don't agree to do anything else, there is no incentive for CSG
to make or to honor agreements. Given CSG's refusal to rotate turns
means their candidate remains VC indefinitely, why would CSG agree to do
anything?
Hope you have some useful suggestions for how we can resolve this
impasse. Or does NCSG need to file a "complaint" with the ombudsman to
get CSG's attention?
Thanks,
Robin
On Jan 28, 2013, at 2:30 PM, Avri Doria wrote:
Hi,
To be honest, I do not see any way beyond this impasse. NCSG believes
we had an agreement that was unilaterally abrogated by CSG. CSG seems
to beleive there was no agreement.
I see no point on coming to any further agreements without some
expectation that the agreement would be honored.
I suggest we just tell the g-council chair that the NCPH, such as it
is, is unable to come to agreement on how to elect a vice chair and go
without one. It is obvious that the leadership of the g-counci is
permanently in CPH hands, so we might as well sit back, relax and quit
trying to find agreement in a circumstance where agreement is illogical.
Chris, thanks for your willingness to moderate this issue, but I do not
see the point of trying.
avri
On 28 Jan 2013, at 13:48, Chris LaHatte wrote:
Dear people
I thought I should mention that I am in the Los Angeles office and
available if needed on this issue. I leave on Saturday 2nd February at
10 pm so subject to my meetings schedule, I am able to meet if you want
to
Regards
Chris LaHatte
Ombudsman
Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
Confidentiality
All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff
or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in
order to further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall
take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board
members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant,
they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such information,
except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint
IP JUSTICE
Robin Gross, Executive Director
1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA
p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451
w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org
IP JUSTICE
Robin Gross, Executive Director
1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA
p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451
w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org
IP JUSTICE
Robin Gross, Executive Director
1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA
p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451
w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org
IP JUSTICE
Robin Gross, Executive Director
1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA
p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451
w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org
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