[PC-NCSG] Fwd: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
Robin Gross
robin
Tue Feb 12 01:06:36 EET 2013
I see your concern, Mary. Thanks. Steve's a slippery one. What if
we re-worded point 2 as follows?:
"2. NCSG is entitled to put forward the initial sole candidate for
the following year (2013-14). This candidate would have to get 8
votes to be selected."
It is currently:
"2. NCSG will have the privilege to put forward a candidate for
the following year (2013-14). This candidate would have to get 8
votes to be selected."
Would that fix the possible difference in interpretation?
Thanks again,
Robin
On Feb 11, 2013, at 2:57 PM, <Mary.Wong at law.unh.edu> wrote:
> Thanks, Robin - and thanks for shepherding this whole thing through
> this long-drawn out process. Just one question - does Steve M's
> email stating that NCSG will have the "privilege" of putting up a
> candidate next year mean that there is NO agreement on rotation,
> i.e. that CSG may well also put up its own candidate, in which case
> there'll be a contested election and the winner will need 8 votes?
>
> Cheers
> Mary
>
>
> Mary W S Wong
> Professor of Law
> Director, Franklin Pierce Center for IP
> Chair, Graduate IP Programs
> UNIVERSITY OF NEW HAMPSHIRE SCHOOL OF LAW
> Two White Street
> Concord, NH 03301
> USA
> Email: mary.wong at law.unh.edu
> Phone: 1-603-513-5143
> Webpage: http://www.law.unh.edu/marywong/index.php
> Selected writings available on the Social Science Research Network
> (SSRN) at: http://ssrn.com/author=437584
>
>
> >>>
> From:
> Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org>
> To:
> NCSG-Policy <PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
> Date:
> 2/10/2013 11:31 PM
> Subject:
> [PC-NCSG] Fwd: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
> FYI
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>> From: Chris LaHatte <chris.lahatte at icann.org>
>> Date: February 9, 2013 10:28:15 PM PST
>> To: Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org>, "Metalitz, Steven"
>> <met at msk.com>
>> Cc: Avri Doria <avri at acm.org>, Tony Holmes
>> <tonyarholmes at btinternet.com>, Marilyn Cade
>> <marilynscade at hotmail.com>, Kristina Rosette <krosette at cov.com>,
>> "Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com)" <wendy at seltzer.com>, Wolfgang
>> Kleinw?chter <wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de>
>> Subject: RE: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
>>
>
>> And I confirm I am happy to facilitate such discussions
>> Regards
>>
>> Chris LaHatte
>> Ombudsman
>> Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
>> Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
>> Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
>>
>>
>> Confidentiality
>> All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
>> confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
>> necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
>> parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
>> Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise
>> staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a
>> complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint.
>> The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure
>> that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence
>> and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the
>> confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to
>> further the resolution of a complaint
>>
>> From: Robin Gross [mailto:robin at ipjustice.org]
>> Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2013 11:07 AM
>> To: Metalitz, Steven
>> Cc: Chris LaHatte; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
>> Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
>> Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position -- CSG support
>>
>> Thank you Steve. Yes, we can agree to this process to move us
>> forward with the issue of a Vice Chair for our house. The only
>> additional request is that we'd like for the ombudsman to
>> participate in the negotiations to set the procedures for 2014
>> (point 3 below).
>>
>> Thanks again,
>> Robin
>>
>>
>> On Feb 5, 2013, at 11:10 AM, Metalitz, Steven wrote:
>>
>>
>> Dear Chris,
>>
>> Thank you again for facilitating our brief but productive meeting
>> last week in Los Angeles.
>>
>> I can now confirm that the CSG can support the following approach
>> which emerged from the meeting:
>>
>>
>> 1. Wolf-Ulrich Knoben will continue as vice chair until the
>> 2013 annual meeting (Buenos Aires). There will be no election.
>> 2. NCSG will have the privilege to put forward a candidate
>> for the following year (2013-14). This candidate would have to get
>> 8 votes to be selected.
>> 3. We will meet as a house no later than the London
>> (mid-2014) meeting to set the procedures that would apply for the
>> term following the 2014 annual meeting (and perhaps beyond).
>>
>> (When we met in LA I was under the impression that the second
>> meeting of CY 2014 was in Singapore. It seems ? though the ICANN
>> announcement is not explicit ? that it will be in London. In any
>> case, the reference in point 3 is to the second meeting of CY 2014
>> as the outside date for this discussion.)
>>
>> If the NCSG representatives can confirm their SG?s approval of
>> this approach, then I believe we can put this matter behind us.
>>
>> Thanks again to all for your respective roles in reaching this
>> conclusion.
>>
>> Steve Metalitz
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Chris LaHatte [mailto:chris.lahatte at icann.org]
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 4:26 PM
>> To: Metalitz, Steven
>> Cc: Robin Gross; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
>> Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
>> Subject: RE: Vice Chair Position
>>
>> I am on my way
>>
>> Chris LaHatte
>> Ombudsman
>> Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
>> Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
>> Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
>>
>>
>> Confidentiality
>> All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
>> confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
>> necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
>> parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
>> Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise
>> staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a
>> complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint.
>> The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure
>> that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence
>> and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the
>> confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to
>> further the resolution of a complaint
>>
>> From: Metalitz, Steven [mailto:met at msk.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 1:23 PM
>> To: Chris LaHatte
>> Cc: Robin Gross; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
>> Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
>> Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position
>>
>> Mockapetris room is available. Shall we convene there?
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jan 30, 2013, at 12:14 PM, "Chris LaHatte"
>> <chris.lahatte at icann.org> wrote:
>> I am in room 412 which is a bit small-depending on who can make it
>> here-It could fit about 6-7 at the most
>>
>> Chris LaHatte
>> Ombudsman
>> Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
>> Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
>> Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
>>
>>
>> Confidentiality
>> All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
>> confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
>> necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
>> parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
>> Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise
>> staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a
>> complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint.
>> The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure
>> that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence
>> and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the
>> confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to
>> further the resolution of a complaint
>>
>> From: Metalitz, Steven [mailto:met at msk.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 11:48 AM
>> To: Chris LaHatte
>> Cc: Robin Gross; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina
>> Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang Kleinw?chter
>> Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position
>>
>> So about 1:30?
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jan 30, 2013, at 11:41 AM, "Chris LaHatte"
>> <chris.lahatte at icann.org> wrote:
>> I can meet at lunch-we will need to find somewhere, but I am sure
>> we can
>>
>> Chris LaHatte
>> Ombudsman
>> Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
>> Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
>> Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
>>
>>
>> Confidentiality
>> All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
>> confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
>> necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
>> parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
>> Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise
>> staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a
>> complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint.
>> The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure
>> that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence
>> and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the
>> confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to
>> further the resolution of a complaint
>>
>> From: Robin Gross [mailto:robin at ipjustice.org]
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 11:38 AM
>> To: Chris LaHatte
>> Cc: Steven Metalitz; Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade;
>> Kristina Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com); Wolfgang
>> Kleinw?chter
>> Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position
>>
>> Thanks, Chris and Steve. How about a chat after the CEO speaks
>> during lunch?
>>
>> Robin
>>
>> On Jan 30, 2013, at 11:14 AM, Chris LaHatte wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks for this. I have seen at least some of the exchanges. I am
>> available except for a meeting at 3 today for about an hour, and
>> tomorrow at 10, and at 1 to 3.45 tomorrow for a meeting with the
>> board. I can meet early morning late evening-whenever suits.
>>
>> Can I encapsulate the issue as to
>>
>> 1. Was the agreement to rotate the nomination a long term
>> agreement or one off only?
>> 2. Is there any reason why, if it was one off only, why you
>> could not agree to let the nomination proceed?
>> By use of the term ?you? I mean both constituencies.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Chris LaHatte
>> Ombudsman
>> Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
>> Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
>> Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
>>
>>
>> Confidentiality
>> All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
>> confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
>> necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
>> parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
>> Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise
>> staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a
>> complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint.
>> The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure
>> that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence
>> and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the
>> confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to
>> further the resolution of a complaint
>>
>> From: Metalitz, Steven [mailto:met at msk.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 11:07 AM
>> To: Chris LaHatte; Robin Gross
>> Cc: Avri Doria; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade; Kristina Rosette; Wendy
>> Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com)
>> Subject: RE: Vice Chair Position
>>
>> Chris,
>>
>> CSG remains glad to speak with you and with NCSG and welcomes your
>> efforts to resolve this. Perhaps we could find a few minutes
>> this afternoon (I note the slot from 1:30 to 3 includes the
>> possibility of break out sessions.
>>
>> We disagree with the characterizations below on factual grounds.
>> As you already have the documentation on what the agreement and
>> where things now stand, I won?t repeat it here. Glad to focus on
>> solutions going forward.
>>
>> Steve Metalitz, IPC
>>
>> From: Chris LaHatte [mailto:chris.lahatte at icann.org]
>> Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 8:26 PM
>> To: Robin Gross
>> Cc: Avri Doria; Metalitz, Steven; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade;
>> Kristina Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com)
>> Subject: RE: Vice Chair Position
>>
>> I am available to talk and perhaps discuss matters separately or
>> together. I just bumped into Marilyn Cade who does want to talk,
>> so perhaps something can be done
>> Regards
>>
>> Chris LaHatte
>> Ombudsman
>> Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
>> Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
>> Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
>>
>>
>> Confidentiality
>> All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
>> confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
>> necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
>> parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
>> Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise
>> staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a
>> complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint.
>> The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure
>> that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence
>> and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the
>> confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to
>> further the resolution of a complaint
>>
>> From: Robin Gross [mailto:robin at ipjustice.org]
>> Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 5:21 PM
>> To: Chris LaHatte
>> Cc: Avri Doria; Steven Metalitz; Tony Holmes; Marilyn Cade;
>> Kristina Rosette; Wendy Seltzer (wendy at seltzer.com)
>> Subject: Re: Vice Chair Position
>>
>> Dear Chris,
>>
>> I would definitely like to resolve this situation this week in LA
>> while we are here. However, we thought we had come to an
>> agreement to rotate turns nominating VC candidates, and if the CSG
>> is not willing to honor that agreement we wonder how useful it
>> would be to try to reach a "new" agreement with them. Since their
>> VC continues on indefinitely, as long as they don't agree to do
>> anything else, there is no incentive for CSG to make or to honor
>> agreements. Given CSG's refusal to rotate turns means their
>> candidate remains VC indefinitely, why would CSG agree to do
>> anything?
>>
>> Hope you have some useful suggestions for how we can resolve this
>> impasse. Or does NCSG need to file a "complaint" with the
>> ombudsman to get CSG's attention?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Robin
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 28, 2013, at 2:30 PM, Avri Doria wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> To be honest, I do not see any way beyond this impasse. NCSG
>> believes we had an agreement that was unilaterally abrogated by
>> CSG. CSG seems to beleive there was no agreement.
>>
>> I see no point on coming to any further agreements without some
>> expectation that the agreement would be honored.
>>
>> I suggest we just tell the g-council chair that the NCPH, such as
>> it is, is unable to come to agreement on how to elect a vice chair
>> and go without one. It is obvious that the leadership of the g-
>> counci is permanently in CPH hands, so we might as well sit back,
>> relax and quit trying to find agreement in a circumstance where
>> agreement is illogical.
>>
>> Chris, thanks for your willingness to moderate this issue, but I
>> do not see the point of trying.
>>
>> avri
>>
>>
>> On 28 Jan 2013, at 13:48, Chris LaHatte wrote:
>>
>> Dear people
>> I thought I should mention that I am in the Los Angeles office and
>> available if needed on this issue. I leave on Saturday 2nd
>> February at 10 pm so subject to my meetings schedule, I am able to
>> meet if you want to
>> Regards
>>
>> Chris LaHatte
>> Ombudsman
>> Blog https://omblog.icann.org/
>> Facebook http://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman
>> Webpage http://www.icann.org/en/help/ombudsman
>>
>>
>> Confidentiality
>> All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as
>> confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps
>> necessary to preserve the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those
>> parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the
>> Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise
>> staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a
>> complainant in order to further the resolution of the complaint.
>> The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure
>> that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence
>> and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the
>> confidential nature of such information, except as necessary to
>> further the resolution of a complaint
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> IP JUSTICE
>> Robin Gross, Executive Director
>> 1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA
>> p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451
>> w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> IP JUSTICE
>> Robin Gross, Executive Director
>> 1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA
>> p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451
>> w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> IP JUSTICE
>> Robin Gross, Executive Director
>> 1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA
>> p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451
>> w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org
>>
>>
>>
IP JUSTICE
Robin Gross, Executive Director
1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA
p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451
w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org
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