[NCSG-FC] Notes of the meeting

Wed Oct 3 06:42:02 EEST 2018

I think thatos resolution is a good one. Let this be resolved during
Stephanie's term if it can be despite my attempts to resolve them before
her arrival it unfortunately seems to be impossible. Discussions  been far
too offensive to me and the committees knowledge about NCSG and how it
 functions and the independence of constituencies is poor  but at the same
time opinionated. A very bad combination. this FC is supposed to be
carrying out crucial functions such as ABRS, fundraising, etc for NCSG and
help us with building our capacity to do policy. Non of which has been done
during this term  and it won't be done when the committee itself doesn't
have a basic understanding of what NCSG does and how it has functioned in
the past to decide about the future and how independence of constitluencies
has to be preserved. I rest my case but I have to say when I step down as
the chair I will closely monitor this FC since it has a tendency to ignore
NCSG members opinions and comments.

I will still pay NCSG civicrm out of my pocket and get reimbursed by Icann
and hope that Stephanie comes up with a plan for NCSG bank account so that
I don't have to continue doing this thankless job.

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 10:49 PM Remmy Nweke <remmyn at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Hi all
> Hope we are all good.
> I am greatly concerned that some of us are still trying to mislead this
> committee by interpreting the Charter and FC functions as if they are
> setting up an adhoc committee. Hence, I decided to share an extract from
> the charter on whether 'oversight' is part of the role of FC or not and
> even some suggestion on FC intervention to be on demand from
> Constituencies. I wish to state that that was not the simple interpretation
> of the charter which was written in simple English. So, I wonder where the
> difficulty is coming from.
>
> And here is the extract defining FC for our information:
>
> "NCSG Finance Committee (NCSG-‐FC): The NCSG Finance Committee is
> responsible for establishing a firm financial footing for the NCSG and
> administering NCSG funds within a defined framework that meets relevant
> legal requirements as well as requirements imposed by ICANN.
>
> The NCSG-‐FC’s responsibilities include fund raising, setting voluntary
> contribution levels for members, *determining procedures for the
> distribution of funds, and for monitoring the utilization of funds.*
>
> The NCSG-‐FC will also be responsible for the Treasurer function.
> Formation of the NCSG-‐FC, its composition, and duties within the
> NCSG-‐FC are set out in Section 2.6."
>
> Therefore, I would like to ask, when a given entity is "determining
> procedures for the distribution of funds, and for monitoring the
> utilization of funds." What is the closest phrase to that than 'oversight'
> which must be done with human face. This was the same argument that brought
> about the insertion of the Section 2.6 into the Operating Procedure to make
> it clearer and some of us went on to tweak it further in the name of
> wording.
>
> I have explained the issue of bank severally, I do not have another
> option, except if those rejecting the idea of SPV can come up with one. SPV
> will save us the trouble of registering yet another entity and search for
> the trustees and management team outside our leaders as most of us are not
> in US.
>
> What matters to me is transparency and understanding. Yes, we may have
> that relatively now, what happens when people who have a wide gap of the
> understanding assumes our current leadership positions. We must be
> futuristic and think stability of NCSG in general.
>
> Lastly, like I had suggested in the past, with the ambiguity in manner of
> interpretation of charter to our caprices, it will be better to review the
> charter afresh now that some of the clauses we put their are getting
> clearer or complicated as some will choose to claim.
>
> *@thatomfikwe *
>
> I saw the note that myself and Farz resolve some issues on Operating
> Procedure, that will not work frankly speaking except we make out time for
> a meeting and take them from page 1 to end and resolve them as a
> team/meeting procedure allows. That is where we cant agree, a vote can be
> taken and we progress. We can have one or two meetings before Farz leaves,
> so it does not sound like someone is waiting for her exit to progress.
>
> So, I will suggest you call for a meeting after affecting the corrections
> you elect to do before now. Starting with doodle will be good.
>
> Also, like I pointed out before now, until we recognise the fact that FC
> is a statutory Committee in NCSG, and accord it full compliment and
> support, rather than placing it like a subcommittee; we may continue the
> merry-go-round.
>
> Best of the day
> Remmy Nweke
> On Mon, Oct 1, 2018 at 11:19 PM Thato Mfikwe <thatomfikwe at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Farzi,
> >
> >
> >
> > I said they edited and not commented on the document and I agree with
> the current language but you may change the term “oversight” to a better
> term as opposed to changing the intention of the clauses themselves. Check
> carefully who made edits.
> >
> >
> >
> > Thato Mfikwe.
> >
> >
> >
> > Sent from Mail for Windows 10
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Bruna Martins dos Santos
> > Sent: Monday, 01 October 2018 22:21
> > To: ncsg-fc at lists.ncsg.is
> > Subject: Re: [NCSG-FC] Notes of the meeting
> >
> >
> >
> > Dear all,
> >
> >
> >
> > I am afraid I did not agree with or suggested any language regarding the
> FC having oversight on constituencies, as I cannot speak on behalf of NCUC
> and dont think our constituency would agree with. What I believe my comment
> was suggesting was to set a definition and trace limits to such oversight
> and maybe even starting a conversation with the broader community.
> >
> >
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Bruna
> >
> >
> >
> > Em seg, 1 de out de 2018 às 17:09, farzaneh badii <
> farzaneh.badii at gmail.com> escreveu:
> >
> > Thato
> >
> >
> >
> > I don't see any comment from Bruna agreeing with FC having oversight on
> constituencies. I see one change by Joan. I have come up with a language
> that is better than direct oversight and in accordance to the charter. I
> suggest removing the constituencies and add to  3(VI)
> >
> >
> >
> > NCSG Finance Committee, at the request of the constituencies, might
> provide advice for management of constituencies funds.
> >
> > I do not agree on this as it leave so FC venerable on what to do and
> what what not to do and dedicat
> >
> > If you and Remmy don't agree with this, then we can go to NCSG list and
> itemize the issues and seek consultation, if not then the only way is to
> send it to NCSG EC. if you want to do that in November so that I'd be gone,
> then by all means do so. I will enumerate all my concerns and submit them
> to NCSG EC and the chair.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 1, 2018 1:32 PM, Thato Mfikwe thatomfikwe at gmail.com wrote:
> >
> > Hi Farzaneh,
> >
> >
> >
> > Bruna and Joan, made some good edits on the section, please checkout the
> current version on the link below, they also believe that the FC should
> have some level of insight, monitoring and review function on constituency
> affairs, for me, the current statement/section is good enough. I also
> removed the management notion in regard to constituency expenditure.
> >
> > :
> >
> >
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XBL9khOhzxRRu5BiwCNeGu4suSfAw3tHFnNldeirnJQ/edit#
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 1, 2018 at 4:15 PM farzaneh badii <farzaneh.badii at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Thato
> >
> >
> >
> > Did you carry this out? Thato to review  3.(III), 3(IV), 3(V), 3(VI) -
> review the oversight and remove and reword then provide to NCSG FC to
> comment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Sep 28, 2018 9:29 AM, Thato Mfikwe thatomfikwe at gmail.com wrote:
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> >
> >
> > 1. Finally I get a little bit of time to help push for submission of the
> draft OP of the NCSG FC, our initial timelines were not met but if we can
> push to submit by end of November that would not be a train smash.
> >
> > 2. Remmy or Farzi, please start integration changes and comments on the
> OP Draft document so that we can prepare for submission to the EC by
> November 2018, and remember to close comment from the community
> >
> > 3. I think we need to hold another meeting towards end of October in
> order to finalise the Draft OP before submission to the EC
> >
> > 4. We need to exercise fairness and consistency in our decision, please
> kindly see my input inline below, thanks.
> >
> >
> >
> > Thato Mfikwe.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Sep 2, 2018 at 4:31 PM farzaneh badii <farzaneh.badii at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Answers in line Remmy
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 31, 2018 at 8:31 PM Remmy Nweke <remmyn at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Farzaneh
> >
> > Thanks for the notes. My comments inline please and in colour.
> >
> > 1.   Stephanie will become NCSG chair either before or after Barcelona
> meeting, automatically a member of FC according to the charter.
> >
> > 2.   Observers: chairs of committees and constituencies within NCSG can
> be invited to FC/Thato wants the chairs to be automatically observers/
> Farzaneh disagrees, Remmy doesn't think that Policy Committee chair should
> become an observer automatically (I hope I got that one right) I am also in
> line with Thato on this and you are correct on my rejection on automatic
> observer for chair for PC.
> >
> > The issue of constituency chairs has been agreed upon (2/3) and minority
> view (1/3) will be recorded, secondly, the observer status of PC chairs is
> good for enhancing synergy and coordination amongst  committees and
> constituencies, provided that the FC chair will also receive observer
> status on the NCG PC (what are you thoughts on this, because at some point
> the FC and the PC need t see eye to eye and this process will create that
> desired platform).
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Well I disagree with any chair being automatically an observer because I
> think the FC should be able to invite members and observers and chairs
> involvement with FC should happen as needed. But I wonder why you are
> specifically against pc chair being an observer? Can you please provide
> your reasons?
> >
> > 1.
> >
> > 2.   2.6 of charter was inserted in the NCSG Finance Committee Operating
> Procedure (accepted_
> >
> > 3.   Constituencies can seek advice about financial matters from the
> finance committee which will be nonbinding/ Discuss on the mailing list
> >
> > 4.   Remove section 5- replace with creating a bank account for NCSG
> (Joan, Stephanie and other FC members to discuss this, I believe Joan and
> Stephanie are in a good position to work together on this. (Considering the
> difficulty of managing the proposed new/separate account model for NCSG
> including the issue of residency and frequency of officers/signatories, its
> going to be a hardnut and pray we thinker on yet another option of that if
> Special Purpose Vehicle [SPV] is not taken entirely/partly.)
> >
> > I think we need to see how treasury functions at constituency level,
> there might be some lessons to learn on how to administer and manage the
> bank account (NCUC chair would be of help in this instance).
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Special purpose vehicle term was not accepted but this doesn't mean
> others won't think about the right avenues for creating ncsg account.
> >
> > 1.
> >
> > 2.   Thato to review  3.(III), 3(IV), 3(V), 3(VI) - review the oversight
> and remove and reword then provide to NCSG FC to comment
> >
> > 3.   ABR submission/ A lightweight process for submission/ Members
> consultation etc
> >
> > 4.   Thato discussed how to receive travel allocation from ICANN.
> Farzaneh disagreed that there is a need but provided some suggestions as to
> how he can approach the issue.
> >
> > Farzi, please list those suggestions
> >
> > 1.   The wording of FC members attending AGM was not changed since Thato
> and Remmy supported it, Farzaneh dissented and will send her dissent. (Is
> sending a dissent to EC part of the Charter requirement on decision making
> in NCSG and FC precisely, especially when one does not agree with majority
> or is it because it still has to go to EC where you preside? What of if FC
> decision stops at FC. Even with this comment here, is dissent already? I do
> not think its necessarily so and should not be encouraged). If a decision
> is taken as Committee despite our various positions, I think it should
> suffice and be respected, rather than creating impression of a divided
> house. IMO. We can disagree to agree eventually.
> >
> > Again minority views will also be recorded.
> >
> >
> >
> > You disregarded members comments on this issue and my comments and did
> not want to come to a reformed language that does not necessarily require
> FC be in ICANN meetings, is in line with our charter but also if the
> opportunity arises enables FC to attend ICANN and other meetings. Hence I
> would like to tell NCSG EC that I don't agree with these provisions that
> you have passed and that it was not a consensus decision. I have discussed
> this many many times and I have no desire to continue and I find it quite
> amusing that you first don't want to come to a compromise and consensus
>  and then ask me not to do a dissent. FC is in charge of creating resources
> for NCSG to do policy. It's not to be a strain on resources.
> >
> >
> >
> > Sorry I thought I sent this on the day of the meeting. Seems like I have
> not.
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks again, great work.
> >
> > ____
> >
> > REMMY NWEKE, mNGE,
> >
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> > (Uyo, Akwa-Ibom State). JOIN us!!
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> >
> >
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> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > *Confidentiality Notice:* The information in this document and
> attachments are confidential and may also be privileged information. It is
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 31, 2018 at 8:19 AM farzaneh badii <farzaneh.badii at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Stephanie will become NCSG chair either before or after Barcelona
> meeting, automatically a member of FC according to the charter
> >
> > Observers: chairs of committees and constituencies within NCSG can be
> invited to FC/Thato wants the chairs to be automatically observers/
> Farzaneh disagrees, Remmy doesn't think that Policy Committee chair should
> become an observer automatically (I hope I got that one right)
> >
> > 2.6 of charter was inserted in the NCSG Finance Committee Operating
> Procedure (accepted_
> >
> > Constituencies can seek advice about financial matters from the finance
> committee which will be nonbinding/ Discuss on the mailing list
> >
> > Remove section 5- replace with creating a bank account for NCSG (Joan,
> Stephanie and other FC members to discuss this, I believe Joan and
> Stephanie are in a good position to work together on this.
> >
> > Thato to review  3.(III), 3(IV), 3(V), 3(VI) - review the oversight and
> remove and reword then provide to NCSG FC to comment
> >
> > ABR submission/ A lightweight process for submission/ Members
> consultation etc
> >
> > Thato discussed how to receive travel allocation from ICANN. Farzaneh
> disagreed that there is a need but provided some suggestions as to how he
> can approach the issue.
> >
> > The wording of FC members attending AGM was not changed since Thato and
> Remmy supported it, Farzaneh dissented and will send her dissent
> >
> > Sorry I thought I sent this on the day of the meeting. Seems like I have
> not.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Farzaneh
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NCSG-FC mailing list
> > NCSG-FC at lists.ncsg.is
> > https://lists.ncsg.is/mailman/listinfo/ncsg-fc
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NCSG-FC mailing list
> > NCSG-FC at lists.ncsg.is
> > https://lists.ncsg.is/mailman/listinfo/ncsg-fc
> >
> > --
> >
> > Farzaneh
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NCSG-FC mailing list
> > NCSG-FC at lists.ncsg.is
> > https://lists.ncsg.is/mailman/listinfo/ncsg-fc
> >
> >
> >
> > Farzaneh
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NCSG-FC mailing list
> > NCSG-FC at lists.ncsg.is
> > https://lists.ncsg.is/mailman/listinfo/ncsg-fc
> >
> >
> >
> > Farzaneh
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NCSG-FC mailing list
> > NCSG-FC at lists.ncsg.is
> > https://lists.ncsg.is/mailman/listinfo/ncsg-fc
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Bruna Martins dos Santos
> >
> >
> >
> > Skype ID: bruna.martinsantos
> >
> > @boomartins
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Virus-free. www.avast.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > NCSG-FC mailing list
> > NCSG-FC at lists.ncsg.is
> > https://lists.ncsg.is/mailman/listinfo/ncsg-fc
> _______________________________________________
> NCSG-FC mailing list
> NCSG-FC at lists.ncsg.is
> https://lists.ncsg.is/mailman/listinfo/ncsg-fc
>
-- 
Farzaneh
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