[PC-NCSG] NCPH Board seat 14 election - results second round

William Drake wjdrake
Sat Apr 19 16:24:54 EEST 2014


Tony Holmes wrote me to saying we need a house pow wow to improve working methods, might be worth proposing a meeting in London?

Best

Bill

On Apr 19, 2014, at 3:06 PM, Stephanie Perrin <stephanie.perrin at mail.utoronto.ca> wrote:

> +1.  Unclear whether our little HLMC committee has some function next week, but they would be the priority.  Not clear why policy cttee needs to cluster on this, i for one have no real contribution to make.  This process is still pretty odd to me.
> And congrats again to Avri for beating the odds!!
> stephanie
> On Apr 19, 2014, at 7:05 AM, Avri Doria <avri at acm.org> wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I am fine with a confcall as long as it does not interfere with any of
>> the NetMundial or other activities of next week.
>> 
>> What do we hope to achieve?  If it is just presenting them with the
>> compromise, I suggest you just do that, and let them chew on it for a
>> bit before any confcall.  Let Sam and others try and convince them that
>> he is middle of the road enough and business friendly enough for them to
>> accept.  That is their issue, they insist on someone who is business
>> friendly.  If Sam can prove he is business friendly and will vote their
>> way on things, he can be on the Board.
>> 
>> The one thing I want to make sure we put forward:  I may not have won,
>> but Bill G. lost, twice, and is _out_.  Theoretically what should be the
>> process for whatever number of candidates, if that a candidate that
>> loses is dropped out, and the remaining, even if just one, runs against
>> NOTA.  But I support our continuing with our compromise proposal of Sam
>> vs. NOTA.
>> 
>> avri
>> 
>> On 19-Apr-14 05:14, Rafik Dammak wrote:
>>> Hi everybody,
>>> 
>>> I goy finally email from Kristina, she was asking if CSG and NCSG need
>>> confcall next week to discuss . since many of us will be in netmundial,
>>> it may be complicated. so please let me if you are ok or not to have
>>> such call. if we have such call, I think that is better to let them know
>>> about the compromise there.
>>> Kristina and me need to contact Jonathan too about the result , checking
>>> with John Jeffrey (the ICANN legal counsel)
>>> 
>>> Best Regards,
>>> 
>>> Rafik 
>>> 
>>> 2014-04-19 1:50 GMT+09:00 Magaly Pazello <magaly.pazello at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:magaly.pazello at gmail.com>>:
>>> 
>>>   Hi!
>>>   It is my understand too, I mean what Maria explained and Rafik
>>>   observations about the CSG reactions.
>>>   Thank you our brave Avri!
>>> 
>>>   For whom is coming to NM have a smooth trip to S?o Paulo. And at the
>>>   airports take care with ATM machines as it is a paradise of
>>>   credit/bank account card fraud!
>>> 
>>>   Magaly
>>> 
>>> 
>>>   On Fri, Apr 18, 2014 at 12:40 PM, Rafik Dammak
>>>   <rafik.dammak at gmail.com <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>       Hi Maria,
>>> 
>>>       Thanks for the summary,
>>>       it is when we have deadlock that we can propose the compromise
>>>       and having the ability to do so. and the only way to reach
>>>       deadlock is at 3rd and final round .
>>>       yes , we can follow the proposal: writing to the NCPH list to
>>>       initiate the discussion regarding compromise candidates. and yes
>>>       we cannot predict CSG reactions and we should be ready for that.
>>>       I already indicated quickly to Kristina when I received the
>>>       results that we should discuss but no reply yet. I think that is
>>>       easter holidays this weekend and probably won't get answer
>>>       quickly ( in addition to those who are travelling to Sao Paulo
>>>       soon). 
>>> 
>>>       Best Regards,
>>> 
>>>       Rafik 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>       2014-04-18 0:57 GMT+09:00 Maria Farrell <maria.farrell at gmail.com
>>>       <mailto:maria.farrell at gmail.com>>:
>>> 
>>>           Hi Marie Laure et al,
>>> 
>>>           Yes, just to be clear, we'd agreed in Singapore to let the
>>>           thing go to three rounds and if it was still deadlocked,i.e.
>>>           an election clearly wasn't going to yield a winning
>>>           candidate, that NCSG would propose Sam to the CSG as a
>>>           compromise candidate both sides of the NCPH could agree on.
>>>           (at least we in the NCSG agree he would be a good candidate,
>>>           and we hope the CSG will agree, too) We didn't want to put
>>>           Sam up against BIll in a vote, but rather in the discussions
>>>           we anticipated might ensue after the vote proved inconclusive.
>>> 
>>>           So I think there should be no scope for any disappointment
>>>           just yet - apart from the obvious disappointment that the
>>>           NCSG's candidate didn't win outright in three rounds of voting.
>>> 
>>>           Now we need to start the process of interacting with the CSG
>>>           on a compromise person to be agreed on by both sides of the
>>>           NCPH, and we all stand behind Sam as that person.
>>> 
>>>           From here on in, we can't predict what the CSG will propose
>>>           or how they will react, so we will have to work very closely
>>>           across the NCSG to make sure we're all happy. 
>>> 
>>>           Let's be clear about precisely how we will take the next
>>>           step. I think we should write to the NCPH list and say
>>>           basically 'there's no clear outcome in the election, so
>>>           shall we discuss compromise candidates?' and if/when they
>>>           agree, say we propose Sam.
>>> 
>>>           How does that sound as a next step?
>>> 
>>>           Maria
>>> 
>>>           p.s. Thank you very, very much, Avri, for standing in the
>>>           election on behalf of the NCSG. It was fantastic that you
>>>           secured the NCA vote, and a shame the ISPs didn't come
>>>           through. Tant pis!
>>> 
>>> 
>>>           On 17 April 2014 16:39, Avri Doria <avri at acm.org
>>>           <mailto:avri at acm.org>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>               Hi,
>>> 
>>>               While I disagree with your interpretation about what was
>>>               agreed to, I
>>>               appreciate you giving me the chance.  And I appreciate
>>>               the fact that all
>>>               of the votes held and I was able to at least get the
>>>               majority vote.
>>> 
>>>               And yes now is the time to propose Sam as the compromise.
>>> 
>>>               Which means he replaces _both_ BillG and me and become a
>>>               sole candidate
>>>               in a election between Sam and none of the above.
>>> 
>>>               That is what I think we agreed to.  And I am pretty sure
>>>               the record
>>>               shows that.
>>> 
>>>               avri
>>> 
>>>               On 17-Apr-14 11:13, Marie-laure Lemineur wrote:
>>>> Dear NCSG-PC members,
>>>> 
>>>> The results of the third round were just released.
>>>                This third round
>>>> ended in a deadlock therefore, as agreed in Singapore,
>>>               NCSG though its
>>>> leadership should proposed Sam as the compromise
>>>               candidate. Just in
>>>> fairness to history and for the record, in Singapore
>>>               we had agreed that
>>>> we would wait for two rounds and if a deadlock
>>>               happened, Sam would be
>>>> proposed as a candidate for the third round. But
>>>               despite that, in order
>>>> to give Avri another opportunity and as a proof of
>>>               good faith, we (
>>>> NPOC) waited for the results of the third round to
>>>               happen. Now, that it
>>>> has happened, and we are going for a fourth round, the
>>>               fair thing to do
>>>> is to that respect the terms of our deal despite the
>>>               disappointment that
>>>> many can feel.
>>>> 
>>>> Best,
>>>> 
>>>> Marie-laure
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Enviado desde mi iPad
>>>> 
>>>> El 14/04/2014, a las 10:29 p.m., Rudi Vansnick
>>>               <rudi.vansnick at isoc.be <mailto:rudi.vansnick at isoc.be>
>>>> <mailto:rudi.vansnick at isoc.be
>>>               <mailto:rudi.vansnick at isoc.be>>> escribi?:
>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Policy Committee members,
>>>>> 
>>>>> As the chair of the NPOC PC, after consulting with
>>>               the committee
>>>>> members, I agree we proceed as is stated in Avri?s
>>>               mail. We go for the
>>>>> 3rd round and if the deadlock happens we proceed with
>>>               Sam Lanfranco as
>>>>> the compromise candidate.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Rudi Vansnick
>>>>> NPOC chair Policy Committee
>>>>> NPOC treasurer
>>>>> rudi.vansnick at npoc.org
>>>               <mailto:rudi.vansnick at npoc.org>
>>>               <mailto:rudi.vansnick at npoc.org
>>>               <mailto:rudi.vansnick at npoc.org>>
>>>>> Tel : +32 (0)9 329 39 16
>>>               <tel:%2B32%20%280%299%20329%2039%2016>
>>>>> Mobile : +32 (0)475 28 16 32
>>>               <tel:%2B32%20%280%29475%2028%2016%2032>
>>>>> www.npoc.org <http://www.npoc.org> <http://www.npoc.org>
>>>>> 
>>>>> Op 14-apr.-2014, om 17:06 heeft Avri Doria
>>>               <avri at acm.org <mailto:avri at acm.org>
>>>>> <mailto:avri at acm.org <mailto:avri at acm.org>>> het
>>>               volgende geschreven:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I hope we are still giving me the third round to see
>>>               what happens.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> If no one wins the 60% in this vote, then we are in
>>>               the deadlock we
>>>>>> spoke of when Sam is proposed as the compromise
>>>               candidate.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Or at least that is what I thought we agreed to.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> thanks
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> avri
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 14-Apr-14 02:47, marie-laure Lemineur wrote:
>>>>>>> Dear Rafik,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I would like to call for an NCSG policy meeting
>>>                soonest in order to
>>>>>>> formally nominate Sam as a candidate for the next
>>>               round.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Marie-laure
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 14, 2014 at 11:18 AM, marie-laure Lemineur
>>>>>>> <mllemineur at gmail.com <mailto:mllemineur at gmail.com>
>>>               <mailto:mllemineur at gmail.com <mailto:mllemineur at gmail.com>>
>>>>>>> <mailto:mllemineur at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:mllemineur at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>  Hi all,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>  I assume that what we agreed on during our NCSG
>>>               policy meeting in
>>>>>>>  Singapore, for the third round, is still on...
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>  best,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>  ml
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>  On Sun, Apr 13, 2014 at 4:59 PM, William Drake
>>>               <wjdrake at gmail.com <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com>>
>>>>>>>  <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>      Mikey is the key.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>      On Apr 12, 2014, at 6:33 PM, Robin Gross
>>>               <robin at ipjustice.org <mailto:robin at ipjustice.org>
>>>>>>> <mailto:robin at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:robin at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>>      <mailto:robin at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:robin at ipjustice.org>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>      This is really great!  Way to go Avri!
>>>                Keep it up, team!!
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>      Best,
>>>>>>>>      Robin
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>      On Apr 12, 2014, at 4:39 AM, Amr Elsadr wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>      Heeey!! Looks like Avri picked up the NCA
>>>               vote this round!! :)
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>      Nice.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>      On Apr 12, 2014, at 12:17 PM, Rafik Dammak
>>>>>>>>>      <rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      Hi ,
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      The result of 2nd round, we are going to
>>>               have a 3rd round.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      Best,
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      Rafik
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>>>>>>>>>      From: "Glen de Saint G?ry"
>>>               <Glen at icann.org <mailto:Glen at icann.org>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Glen at icann.org <mailto:Glen at icann.org>>
>>>>>>>>>>      <mailto:Glen at icann.org
>>>               <mailto:Glen at icann.org>>>
>>>>>>>>>>      Date: Apr 12, 2014 4:03 PM
>>>>>>>>>>      Subject: NCPH Board seat 14 election -
>>>               results second round
>>>>>>>>>>      To: "krosette at cov.com
>>>               <mailto:krosette at cov.com> <mailto:krosette at cov.com
>>>               <mailto:krosette at cov.com>>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:krosette at cov.com <mailto:krosette at cov.com>>"
>>>>>>>>>>      <krosette at cov.com
>>>               <mailto:krosette at cov.com> <mailto:krosette at cov.com
>>>               <mailto:krosette at cov.com>>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:krosette at cov.com
>>>               <mailto:krosette at cov.com>>>,
>>>>>>>>>>      "rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>>"
>>>>>>>>>>      <rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:rafik.dammak at gmail.com>>>
>>>>>>>>>>      Cc: "Glen de Saint G?ry" <Glen at icann.org
>>>               <mailto:Glen at icann.org>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Glen at icann.org <mailto:Glen at icann.org>>
>>>>>>>>>>      <mailto:Glen at icann.org
>>>               <mailto:Glen at icann.org>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      __ __
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      Dear Kristina and Rafik,____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      __ __
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      Please find the results of the second
>>>               round of voting which
>>>>>>>>>>      closed on Friday, 11 April at 23:59 UTC.
>>>>>>>>>>      Final tally :____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      *__ __*
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>        7 votes     Avri Doria____
>>>>>>>>>>        6 votes     Bill Graham____
>>>>>>>>>>        0 vote      None of the above____
>>>>>>>>>>      __ __
>>>>>>>>>>      We await your instructions to continue
>>>               with the third
>>>>>>>>>> round of voting due to open at 07:00UTC on 14
>>>               April 2014 and
>>>>>>>>>> close on 16 April at 23:59 UTC.  Please provide
>>>               us with the text
>>>>>>>>>> for the ballot and any covering note that has to
>>>               be sent with the
>>>>>>>>>> vote.____
>>>>>>>>>>      __ __
>>>>>>>>>>      Thank you.____
>>>>>>>>>>      Kind regards,____
>>>>>>>>>>      __ __
>>>>>>>>>>      Glen____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      *__ __*
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      *Machine tally:
>>>>>>>>>>      **Total Ballots Cast (including
>>>               duplicates):*13
>>>>>>>>>>      *Ballots Counted (excluding duplicates):* 13
>>>>>>>>>>      *Voters Who Haven't Voted:* 0 *____*
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      *Ballot with added tally (using weights,
>>>               if any):*____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>                      Select just one of the
>>>               nominees below____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      1:  7 votes    [] Avri Doria____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      2:  6 votes    [] Bill Graham____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      3:  0 votes    [] None of the above____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      *__ __*
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      *Ballots Received:*____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      __ __
>>>>>>>>>> 
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>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      Glen de Saint G?ry ____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      GNSO Secretariat ____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      gnso.secretariat at gnso.icann.org
>>>               <mailto:gnso.secretariat at gnso.icann.org>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:gnso.secretariat at gnso.icann.org
>>>               <mailto:gnso.secretariat at gnso.icann.org>>
>>>>>>>>>>      <mailto:gnso.secretariat at gnso.icann.org
>>>               <mailto:gnso.secretariat at gnso.icann.org>> ____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      http://gnso.icann.org
>>>               <http://gnso.icann.org/>____
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>      __ __
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>                _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>      PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>      PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>>>>>      http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>                _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>      PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>>>>>>>      PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>>>>      http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>      PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>>>>>>      PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>>>      http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>      ***********************************************
>>>>>>>      William J. Drake
>>>>>>>      International Fellow & Lecturer
>>>>>>>        Media Change & Innovation Division, IPMZ
>>>>>>>        University of Zurich, Switzerland
>>>>>>>      Chair, Noncommercial Users Constituency,
>>>>>>>        ICANN, www.ncuc.org <http://www.ncuc.org>
>>>               <http://www.ncuc.org> <http://www.ncuc.org>
>>>>>>>      william.drake at uzh.ch
>>>               <mailto:william.drake at uzh.ch>
>>>               <mailto:william.drake at uzh.ch <mailto:william.drake at uzh.ch>>
>>>>>>>      <mailto:william.drake at uzh.ch
>>>               <mailto:william.drake at uzh.ch>> (direct),
>>>               wjdrake at gmail.com <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com>>
>>>>>>>      <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com
>>>               <mailto:wjdrake at gmail.com>> (lists),
>>>>>>>        www.williamdrake.org
>>>               <http://www.williamdrake.org> <http://www.williamdrake.org>
>>>>>>> <http://www.williamdrake.org>
>>>>>>>      ***********************************************
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>      PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>>>>>      PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>> <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>>      http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>>>>> PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>>> http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>>>> PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>>> http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>>> PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>>               <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>>
>>>>> http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>> 
>>>               _______________________________________________
>>>               PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>               PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>               http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>           _______________________________________________
>>>           PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>           PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>           http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>       _______________________________________________
>>>       PC-NCSG mailing list
>>>       PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org <mailto:PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org>
>>>       http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> PC-NCSG mailing list
>>> PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>>> http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
>>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> PC-NCSG mailing list
>> PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
>> http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> PC-NCSG mailing list
> PC-NCSG at ipjustice.org
> http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/pc-ncsg





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