GNSO Council|and GAC

Fri Apr 22 14:10:14 EEST 2022

While this thread about our letter to the GNSO Council about closed
generics is amusing, it also clearly shows how GNSO council cannot and is
not willing to resist the requests to come up with completely new
frameworks to appease GAC. Especially pay attention to what Jeff is saying.
Jeff is the GNSO Council liaison to GAC. If they don't add our letter to
the communication, we can send a shorter one to the Board and to GAC
specifically. This is not about closed generics, this is about adhering to
our principles and processes at ICANN and not coming up with ad hoc
processes that empower GAC even further.

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: philippe.fouquart--- via council <council at gnso.icann.org>
Date: Fri, Apr 22, 2022 at 2:57 PM
Subject: Re: [council] Draft letter to the Board on closed generics dialogue
To: Jeff Neuman <jeff at jjnsolutions.com>, Justine Chew <
justine.chew.icann at gmail.com>, Kurt Pritz <kurt at kjpritz.com>
Cc: GNSO Secs <gnso-secs at icann.org>, council at gnso icann. org <
council at gnso.icann.org>

Kurt, Justine, Jeff, thanks for the inputs.

On 1) and reference to the NCSG’s letter: The reference is on record with
the minutes, and can also be found in the Council list archive, I don’t
think there’s any risk this goes unnoticed, I’d suggest we simply say While
the Council is willing to pursue these next steps, it is important to note
that Non-Commercial Stakeholders Group expressed its opposition to the
approach.

Manju (since it is you who spoke on this during our call): would you be
fine with this?

On 2) and modalities, I’d suggest we go for Jeff’s edits and simply say in
the second paragraph:

The Council is appreciative of the ICANN Board’s attention to GNSO related
matters and is willing to pursue next steps for the facilitated dialogue,
subject to mutual agreement with the GAC on the conditions for that
dialogue.

Ironically, in French, the equivalent of ‘modalities’ has a sense of a
series of menial tasks that the authors would consider a) quite
straightforward and b) as a result, generally not worth doing by
themselves. Neither of which would probably be true here I think.

It seems 2) alleviates the need to elaborate as, Justine, you suggested
with your 3rd point but let us know if it doesn’t work.

As attached with diff marks.

Regards,

Philippe

*From:* Jeff Neuman <jeff at jjnsolutions.com>
*Sent:* Friday, April 22, 2022 3:48 PM
*To:* Justine Chew <justine.chew.icann at gmail.com>; Kurt Pritz <
kurt at kjpritz.com>; FOUQUART Philippe INNOV/NET <philippe.fouquart at orange.com
>
*Cc:* GNSO Secs <gnso-secs at icann.org>; council at gnso icann. org <
council at gnso.icann.org>
*Subject:* RE: [council] Draft letter to the Board on closed generics
dialogue

I strongly urge that the letter from the NCSG is not included with this
letter.  As Justine states, there are some mischaracterizations  in that
letter and as far as I am aware the rest of the Council does not agree with
the opinions expressed by the NCSG.  You can indicate that the NCSG opposed
the meeting in the letter without any attachments.  If you include the NCSG
letter, would you consider adding letters from the other SGs and Cs that
are in support of the meeting?  I believe the best way is to note the
NCSG’s disagreement, but not attach anything.

And with respect to the word “modalities”, it is an unnecessary word.  A
“modality” is a condition is it not?  So I would just state: “….that the
Council is willing to pursue next steps for the facilitated dialogue,
subject to mutual agreement with the GAC on the conditions for that
dialogue.”

Jeffrey J. Neuman

Founder & CEO

JJN Solutions, LLC

p: +1.202.549.5079

E: jeff at jjnsolutions.com

http://jjnsolutions.com

*From:* council <council-bounces at gnso.icann.org> *On Behalf Of *Justine
Chew via council
*Sent:* Thursday, April 21, 2022 8:12 PM
*To:* Kurt Pritz <kurt at kjpritz.com>; Philippe Fouquart <
philippe.fouquart at orange.com>
*Cc:* GNSO Secs <gnso-secs at icann.org>; council at gnso icann. org <
council at gnso.icann.org>
*Subject:* Re: [council] Draft letter to the Board on closed generics
dialogue

Hello Philippe, Kurt,

1. I agree with Kurt on the NCSG letter, and if it were to be included, I
think we should at least address the assertion that "GAC has been silent
since 2013 on the matter of Closed Generics" as called out by Jeff as a
mis-characterization of the GAC on the part of NCSG.

2. I understand the word "modalities" to mean "ways of doing something",
but if there's a better word to address Kurt's concerns then by all means,
let's consider that.

3. Would it be feasible to add to the end of the second paragraph, a
suggestion that "the conditions and modalities for that dialogue" will be
forthcoming? That would indicate that Council is giving thought to those
and will continue to do so (hence allowing for the Closed Generics small
team leeway to do its work).

Thanks for considering.

Kind regards,
Justine

On Fri, 22 Apr 2022 at 06:54, Kurt Pritz via council <council at gnso.icann.org>
wrote:

Hi Philippe:

Two comments:

1. If the NCSG has requested that reference to their comment should be
included it in the letter, then we should include it. If not, you might ask
 if they want that (and if they do, include it). I don’t think it adds
value at this point — but will add value as we get into the meeting set-up,
the discussion scope, and the actions taken with any recommendations that
come out of the meeting.

2. I personally recommend that we avoid the use of the term ‘modalities.’ I
don’t know what it means and, if participating in a group tasked with
identifying them, I wouldn’t know what they are. I right clicked on the
word and found that Microsoft knows of no synonyms. I looked it up in a
popular online dictionary and came up with:

— the quality or state of being modal;  a modal quality or attribute;

— the classification of logical propositions according to their asserting
or denying the possibility, impossibility, contingency, or necessity of
their content;

— one of the main avenues of sensation (such as vision);

— a usually physical therapeutic agency

Not getting the sense from there, I looked for its use in a sentence and
found:

"Ineluctable modality of the visible: at least that if no more, thought
through my eyes.” *The New Yorker, 7 Feb. 2022*

That did not help me understand the definition but did tell me a lot about
the kind of people that use the word. I understand the word is commonly
used in governmental settings but we needn’t adopt the custom if it is not
clarifying or helpful.

Slightly more seriously, when we meet among ourselves and with the GAC, we
should all understand the target and “modalities” seems too broad. It would
be helpful for me (maybe it is just me) to replace the word with commonly
spoken terms or to parenthetically define it.

Thanks for listening,

Kurt

On Apr 22, 2022, at 3:32 AM, philippe.fouquart--- via council <
council at gnso.icann.org> wrote:

Dear Councilors,

Please find attached for you review a draft response letter to the ICANN
Board on closed generics. It intends to capture the conclusions of our
discussion during the Council call last week.

We would like to have it ready for the Board workshop next week, so please
have a look before April 27th 1200 UTC (Wednesday)

Thanks.

Regards,

Philippe

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