<div dir="auto"><div>Hi.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I would object. It looks like a zero -sum game strategy. Instead of working toward neutrality, we will try to get co-chairs or vice-chairs to keep each one in check. It doesn't look a good way to build team or encouraging for everyone to commit.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Best,</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Rafik </div><div dir="auto"><br><div class="gmail_quote" dir="auto"><div dir="ltr">On Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 8:53 PM Kathy Kleiman <<a href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com">kathy@kathykleiman.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
  <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
    <p>Ayden, fair enough :-)</p>
    <p>But I think the RDS did not work for other reasons - namely, the
      ongoing refusal of certain members to believe the GDPR was real.
      That was not the job of the Chair/Vice-Chair. In that case, I
      think it was critical that Michele and David were alongside Chuck
      and Susan Kawaguchi in the RDS endeavor. Can you imagine if they
      had not been?  <br>
    </p>
    <p>When we needed something, we went to David and Michele... I think
      the principle still holds. I don't see neutrality in anyone's
      formula on this one. Absent that, balance is key (everything often
      weighs on it). I think you would be a great vice-chair, for
      example :-)!<br>
    </p>
    <p>Best, K<br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="m_4675942790337677357moz-cite-prefix">On 6/20/2018 7:48 AM, Ayden Férdeline
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite">The
      problem is that the RDS PDP WG crashed and therefore did not work
      :-(
      <div> <br>
      </div>
      <div>We have discussed trying something new at the Council level
        and, given how small the EPDP is likely to be, I think others
        are right to say we should keep the leadership to 1 neutral
        chair (hard to find we realise) and possibly 1 vice chair or a
        co-chair. I really don’t see the point in having a larger
        leadership team. We’ll only have 3 people on the EPDP, why do we
        want one to have to be neutral?</div>
      <div> <br>
      </div>
      <div>I am not set on anything yet and can be persuaded otherwise,
        but above is my current train of thought. Thanks </div>
      <div> <br>
      </div>
      <div>Best wishes, Ayden
        <div> <br>
        </div>
        <div id="m_4675942790337677357protonmail_mobile_signature_block">Sent from ProtonMail
          Mobile</div>
        <div> <br>
          <div>
            <div> <br>
            </div>
            On Wed, Jun 20, 2018 at 13:43, Kathy Kleiman <<a href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kathy@kathykleiman.com</a>>
            wrote:</div>
          <blockquote class="m_4675942790337677357protonmail_quote" type="cite">
            <p>I think it works well when there is one representative
              from every (major) stakeholder group on the leadership
              team (co-chairs or chair and vice-chairs). That means that
              every (major) position is represented in the main
              considerations of scheduling, preparation, and
              presentation. This is how RDS works; and this is how RPM
              works. Otherwise, we wind up with situations like the
              Accreditation Groups with IPC as chair/lead, and BC as
              chair/lead.</p>
            <p>One chair and two vice chairs would ensure that the CPH,
              and both sets of user groups are represented. In the
              absence of neutrality (for there will be little here),
              balance is key :-)!</p>
            <p>Best, Kathy <br>
            </p>
            <br>
            <div class="m_4675942790337677357moz-cite-prefix">On 6/20/2018 2:30 AM, Dr.
              Tatiana Tropina wrote: <br>
            </div>
            <blockquote type="cite">
              <p>Agree with Rafik, too. I don't see what is the big
                difference between two co-chairs and chair/vice-chair
                set up (as I assume they are interchangeable when one
                person can't be present at the time-consuming meetings
                for whatever reason and they share the workload). I
                wouldn't favour the council selection - rather leave it
                to the group (or SSC, but I'd prefer the group selecting
                them). However, on the latter issue I'll go with any
                position PC develops - to me
                membership/size/participation is more important because
                if the group is sizeable and manageable and -- as I
                prefer downsizing it to no more 3 members from SG -- the
                leadership issue is less of a problem. These two are
                intertwined, IMHO. <br>
              </p>
              <p>Cheers,</p>
              <p>Tanya <br>
              </p>
              <br>
              <div class="m_4675942790337677357moz-cite-prefix">On 20/06/18 06:42, farzaneh
                badii wrote: <br>
              </div>
              <blockquote type="cite">
                <div dir="ltr">
                  <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Rafik</div>
                  <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"> <br>
                  </div>
                  <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">I agree with
                    you. Two co-chairs or Chair and vice chair would be
                    good. </div>
                  <div>
                    <div dir="ltr" class="m_4675942790337677357gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
                      <div dir="ltr">
                        <div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Farzaneh </font>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <br>
                </div>
                <br>
                <div class="gmail_quote">
                  <div dir="ltr">On Tue, Jun 19, 2018 at 7:57 PM Rafik
                    Dammak < <a href="mailto:rafik.dammak@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">rafik.dammak@gmail.com</a>>
                    wrote: <br>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex">
                    <div dir="ltr">
                      <div class="gmail_quote">
                        <div link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72" lang="EN-US">
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif">Hi,</font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif"><br>
                            </font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif">as we started the discussion
                              at EPDP DT on different topics, I hope
                              that we can coordinate our positions here.</font>
                          </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif"><br>
                            </font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif">I don't have a strong
                              preference in term of leardership
                              composition but it shouldn't be itself big
                              when we are trying to keep the EPDP team
                              at small size. so 2 co-chair or chair and
                              vice-chair is enough as they have to be
                              from the team itself  and we shouldn't
                              jeoprodize participation.  Selection by
                              the team itself is fine. appointment by
                              council has its own merit but I think that
                              may lead to over-engineered solution and
                              spending time in process (e.g. shall we
                              delegate to SSC?).</font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif"><br>
                            </font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif">I expect that GNSO council
                              leadership should be ex-officio there to
                              keep up to date but not participating in
                              discussion.</font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif"><br>
                            </font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif">please share your thoughts
                              too.</font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif"><br>
                            </font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif">Best,</font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif"><br>
                            </font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica,
                              sans-serif">Rafik</font> </div>
                          <div class="m_4675942790337677357m_-419958809599559947m_-4450792714631890705WordSection1">
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">ps we will start soon
                              our own process for appointing members
                              while the work is going on membership
                              requirements in the charter.</p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> <br>
                            </p>
                            <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                              <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From:
                                  </span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">council
                                  <<a href="mailto:council-bounces@gnso.icann.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">council-bounces@gnso.icann.org</a>>
                                  on behalf of "McGrady, Paul D." <<a href="mailto:PMcGrady@winston.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">PMcGrady@winston.com</a>><br>
                                  <b>Date: </b>Tuesday, June 19, 2018
                                  at 16:14<br>
                                  <b>To: </b>GNSO Council List <<a href="mailto:council@gnso.icann.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">council@gnso.icann.org</a>><br>
                                  <b>Subject: </b>[council] ePDP DT /
                                  Leadership Issues</span> </p>
                            </div>
                            <div>
                              <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            </div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">I think we have at
                              least two questions to address:</p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <ol style="margin-top:0in" start="1" type="1">
                              <li class="MsoNormal"> What is the ideal
                                configuration of the leadership team for
                                an EPDP? </li>
                            </ol>
                            <ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
                              <li class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in;text-align:justify">1
                                chair </li>
                              <li class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in;text-align:justify">2
                                or more co-chairs</li>
                              <li class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in;text-align:justify">1
                                chair and 1 or more vice-chairs</li>
                              <li class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in;text-align:justify">
                                Some other model</li>
                            </ul>
                            <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"> </p>
                            <ol style="margin-top:0in" start="2" type="1">
                              <li class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"> Depending on
                                the answer to the above, who should be
                                nominated for leadership and what is
                                that process?  Historically, WG’s select
                                their own leadership and that is
                                ratified by the Council.  Is that the
                                same plan for the ePDP?</li>
                            </ol>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Let’s discuss. </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">PS: From the chat on
                              today’s call I saw (and want to capture
                              for your discussion): </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Ayden Ferdeline: Chair
                              - Thomas Rickert </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Best,</p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Paul</p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:gray"> </span>
                            </p>
                            <div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:gray">
                                <hr size="1" align="center" width="100%">
                              </span> </div>
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