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    <p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Wednesday is still our
          day alone to use as we see fit.  Chuck is trying to get Mr
          Cannatucci to attend our RDS meeting on Wednesday., I will
          forward that thread to you as well.  All the other sessions
          are monday</font></font><br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2017-02-14 23:59, farzaneh badii
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAN1qJvABSuPBg6FyXsEbUK7MAWAcLrmv2POz_AHEkB8g1_qZTA@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
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        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Hi Stephanie,</div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
        </div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">We both asked Maryam to
          follow up on NCSG session with the UN special rapp. I think
          would be helpful that Tapani also follows up since it's an
          NCSG request and we still don't see it on the schedule. Did I
          interpret it wrong that you said Chuck was planning to turn
          that into a GNSO meeting. Is the wednesday session only NCSG
          meeting wtih the UN rapp?</div>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
        <div>
          <div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
            <div dir="ltr">
              <div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Farzaneh </font></div>
            </div>
          </div>
        </div>
        <br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at 11:23 PM,
          Stephanie Perrin <span dir="ltr"><<a
              moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"
              target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
              <p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">What
                    happened is this:</font></font></p>
              <ul>
                <li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">GAC was
                      asked to sponsor, never got it done</font></font></li>
                <li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">GNSO was
                      asked to sponsor, proposed instead to replace a
                      lapsed HIT with this panel</font></font></li>
                <li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Invitations
                      went out for the opening day of the conference
                      (they had to, these are busy guys) <br>
                    </font></font></li>
                <li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">IPC
                      weighed in demanding balanced HIT style panels
                      (Victoria sheckler their person on this)<br>
                    </font></font></li>
                <li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Side
                      meetings have apparently been arranged</font></font></li>
                <li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">only guy
                      available for our meeting on Wednesday is UN
                      Special Rapporteur for privacy (grateful for this,
                      this is a big deal and I am trying to get his
                      latest book read prior to the event </font></font></li>
              </ul>
              <p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Last version
                    I saw of the schedule we did not have a session. 
                    You were checking on that.  Chuck Gomes was asking
                    for time for the PDP on RDS but Monday is only day,
                    he is trying for 8 am breakfast meeting.</font></font></p>
              <p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">cheers Steph<br>
                  </font></font></p>
              <div>
                <div class="h5">
                  <p><br>
                  </p>
                  <br>
                  <div class="m_-1196239896132014116moz-cite-prefix">On
                    2017-02-14 23:09, farzaneh badii wrote:<br>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote type="cite">
                    <div dir="ltr">
                      <div class="gmail_default"
                        style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Hi
                        Stephanie,</div>
                      <div class="gmail_default"
                        style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div class="gmail_default"><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Can you
                          clarify something for me? Is this the </span><font
                          face="verdana, sans-serif">Cross- </font><font
                          face="verdana, sans-serif">Community </font><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Discussion </span><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">wi<wbr>th
                          Data </span><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Protection </span><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Commissioners</span><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">?<wbr> </span></div>
                      <div class="gmail_default"><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                        </span></div>
                      <div class="gmail_default"><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">If so,
                          didn't we also submit a session request ( NCSG
                          request)? Did that turn into the above
                          session? Where did this session come from and
                          where is NCSG session?</span></div>
                      <div class="gmail_default"><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                        </span></div>
                    </div>
                    <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
                      <div>
                        <div
                          class="m_-1196239896132014116gmail_signature"
                          data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
                          <div dir="ltr">
                            <div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Farzaneh
                              </font></div>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                      <br>
                      <div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at
                        10:43 PM, Stephanie Perrin <span dir="ltr"><<a
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"
                            target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.<wbr>utoronto.ca</a>></span>
                        wrote:<br>
                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0
                          0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                          solid;padding-left:1ex">
                          <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
                            <p>I am biting my tongue on this.  As some
                              of you heard,  I raised this with Goran. 
                              I am tempted to just slide it along to
                              him.  With of course a mention of how the
                              GAC and ICANN staff sat on this from
                              Hyderabad until mid January.</p>
                            <p>Suggestions welcome.  Pissed off, am I. <br>
                            </p>
                            <p>Steph<br>
                            </p>
                            <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-forward-container"><br>
                              <br>
                              -------- Forwarded Message --------
                              <table
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-email-headers-table"
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                                  <tr>
                                    <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap"
                                      valign="BASELINE">Subject: </th>
                                    <td>Re: ICANN58 Data Protection
                                      Session Planning</td>
                                  </tr>
                                  <tr>
                                    <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap"
                                      valign="BASELINE">Date: </th>
                                    <td>Tue, 14 Feb 2017 21:52:54 -0500</td>
                                  </tr>
                                  <tr>
                                    <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap"
                                      valign="BASELINE">From: </th>
                                    <td>Greg Shatan <a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com" target="_blank"><gregshatanipc@gmail.com></a></td>
                                  </tr>
                                  <tr>
                                    <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap"
                                      valign="BASELINE">To: </th>
                                    <td>KIMPIAN Peter <a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:Peter.KIMPIAN@coe.int" target="_blank"><Peter.KIMPIAN@coe.int></a></td>
                                  </tr>
                                  <tr>
                                    <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap"
                                      valign="BASELINE">CC: </th>
                                    <td>Victoria Sheckler <a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
                                        href="mailto:vsheckler@riaa.com"
                                        target="_blank"><vsheckler@riaa.com></a>,
                                      James M. Bladel <a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:jbladel@godaddy.com" target="_blank"><jbladel@godaddy.com></a>,
                                      <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com" target="_blank">kathy@kathykleiman.com</a>
                                      <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com" target="_blank"><kathy@kathykleiman.com></a>,
                                      <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:donna.austin@neustar.biz" target="_blank">donna.austin@neustar.biz</a>
                                      <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:donna.austin@neustar.biz" target="_blank"><donna.austin@neustar.biz></a>,
                                      <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:heather.forrest@acu.edu.au" target="_blank">heather.forrest@acu.edu.au</a>
                                      <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:heather.forrest@acu.edu.au" target="_blank"><heather.forrest@acu.edu.au></a>,
                                      Stephanie Perrin <a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" target="_blank"><stephanie.perrin@mail.utoront<wbr>o.ca></a>,
                                      KWASNY Sophie <a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:Sophie.KWASNY@coe.int" target="_blank"><Sophie.KWASNY@coe.int></a>,
                                      Wilson, Christopher <a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
                                        href="mailto:cwilson@21cf.com"
                                        target="_blank"><cwilson@21cf.com></a>,
                                      Tony Holmes <a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:tonyarholmes@btinternet.com" target="_blank"><tonyarholmes@btinternet.com></a></td>
                                  </tr>
                                </tbody>
                              </table>
                              <br>
                              <br>
                              <div dir="ltr">
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">All,</div>
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                </div>
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">
                                  <div class="gmail_default"
                                    style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font
                                      face="verdana, sans-serif"><i>First,
                                        apologies for the length of this
                                        message and a tone that is more
                                        strident than I intend it to
                                        be.  Another pass through this
                                        email could smooth the rough
                                        edges, but it is 2:45 am in
                                        Reykjavik and I have a 7:15
                                        breakfast meeting, so my
                                        capacity is exhausted (and so am
                                        I).  Please read this with a
                                        friendly, collegial tone in mind
                                        and indulge me  where I have
                                        failed to have the tone of the
                                        text match my desire to be a
                                        good working partner (and to
                                        "disagree without being
                                        disagreeable") even where our
                                        perspectives may differ.  (As
                                        partial explanation, my sport of
                                        choice in my youth was rugby ("a
                                        ruffian's game played by
                                        gentlemen"), while fencing
                                        probably would have been more
                                        apropos....)</i></font></div>
                                  <div class="gmail_default"
                                    style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font
                                      face="verdana, sans-serif"><br>
                                    </font></div>
                                  <div class="gmail_default"
                                    style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">I am quite concerned with where
                                      we are in this discussion.  There
                                      are either some substantial
                                      misunderstandings about what this
                                      session, as a "High Interest
                                      Topic", is supposed to be -- or
                                      there is an apparent intent to
                                      exclude perspectives that will
                                      keep this from being a celebration
                                      of data protection principles.  I
                                      hope it's the former, but even
                                      that is unfortunate.</span><br>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                </div>
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Perhaps
                                  the root of the problem is combining
                                  the original idea for a CoE-organized
                                  presentation with the High Interest
                                  Topic (HIT) concept -- or perhaps that
                                  just highlighted the inherent problem
                                  with the session.  HIT doesn't just
                                  refer to a level of interest -- it's
                                  supposed to be a community-generated
                                  proposal that is then planned and
                                  presented with multistakeholder
                                  participation (and <u>not</u> merely
                                  by the proposing organization).  One
                                  of the problems we had with the last
                                  round of HITs was a proposal for a HIT
                                  session to be planned and presented by
                                  a single part of the community,
                                  largely consisting of a presentation
                                  by one of its members and only minor
                                  roles for any sector not sympathetic
                                  to the views of this member and
                                  community group.  This was
                                  inconsistent with the idea that the
                                  proposing organization does not
                                  control the content of a HIT session. 
                                  Fortunately, the original planners
                                  agreed to to expand to a more diverse
                                  planning team, with the result being a
                                  more diverse panel and a very lively
                                  and well-received session.  When
                                  community leaders got on the phone to
                                  consider this round of HITs, we wanted
                                  to avoid a replay of this situation
                                  (although it ended well enough).</div>
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                </div>
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">When
                                  this data protection session was
                                  brought to the community leaders group
                                  as a late suggestion for one of the
                                  HIT slots, I was concerned we might be
                                  heading for a replay, so the IPC
                                  specified that one of our members
                                  (Vicky) should be added to the
                                  planning group (knowing that at least
                                  one other constituency shared very
                                  similar concerns). Unlike the last
                                  time, where we were able to get a hand
                                  on the tiller and help turn the ship,
                                  I've found our attempts to be largely
                                  rebuffed.  This has been increasingly
                                  frustrating.</div>
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                </div>
                                <div class="gmail_default"
                                  style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">I'd
                                  like to respond to some of the
                                  specific statements on this thread
                                  since I last had an opportunity to
                                  respond:</div>
                                <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
                                  <div class="gmail_quote">
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">Vicky
                                      wrote: </div>
                                    <span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt">I
                                      don’t see here (but I am also
                                      sleep deprived) which panelist
                                      will represent public safety /
                                      transparency / enforcement
                                      concerns.</span></div>
                                  <div class="gmail_quote"><span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"><br>
                                    </span></div>
                                  <p class="MsoNormal"
                                    style="color:rgb(80,0,80)"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"
                                      lang="EN-US"></span></p>
                                  <div class="gmail_quote">
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">​</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">​Peter
                                      responded: </div>
                                    <span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt">Uuhhh,
                                      if you are in US it is quite early
                                      for you…in my sense usually the
                                      governments are responsible and
                                      accountable for the issues you
                                      mentioned, therefore it seemed to
                                      me logical that those issues will
                                      be taken care by a representative
                                      of the GAC. Besides that, the PSWG
                                      is a sub-group of the GAC which is
                                      deliberately discussing those
                                      issues you mentioned…</span></div>
                                  <div class="gmail_quote"><span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"><br>
                                    </span></div>
                                  <div class="gmail_quote"><span
                                      style="font-family:calibri,sans-serif"><font
                                        color="#000000">
                                        <div class="gmail_default"
                                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"><span
                                            style="font-size:11pt">​</span>Greg:
                                          This misses the point of
                                          Vicky's question​ and perhaps
                                          misses a fundamental point
                                          about ICANN -- that it is a
                                          multistakeholder organization
                                          and <i>not</i> a multilateral
                                          organization.  Governments are
                                          not the only ones concerned
                                          with investigation and
                                          enforcement -- there are also
                                          significant parts of the
                                          private sector deeply engaged
                                          in investigation and
                                          enforcement (and not to put
                                          too fine a point on it, but
                                          IPC (my group and Vicky's
                                          group) represents one of those
                                          parts of the private sector). 
                                          As such, at least one voice
                                          from these parts of the
                                          private sector should be
                                          present on the panel.  Even
                                          within governments, there are
                                          parts that deal with public
                                          safety and enforcement.  The
                                          idea that a representative of
                                          the GAC will provide this
                                          perspective seems mistaken. 
                                          As fine a chair as the GAC
                                          chair is, I don't believe this
                                          is his perspective, and the
                                          suggestion this would be
                                          within his brief seemed based
                                          more on protocol than
                                          practicality.  As revealed in
                                          this thread, Ms. Bauer-Bulst
                                          is the co-chair of the PSWG,
                                          so would be more on point for
                                          this perspective (though
                                          apparently she is not
                                          sufficiently august to appear
                                          on the panel, even if she is a
                                          Deputy Head of Unit, and not
                                          merely a Team Leader as was
                                          stated earlier in this
                                          exchange).</div>
                                      </font></span></div>
                                  <div class="gmail_quote">
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div>
                                      <div class="gmail_default"
                                        style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​​Peter
                                        replied to James Bladel in red
                                        below:</div>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​</div>
                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                      style="margin:0px 0px 0px
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                                      rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
                                          <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
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                                                <p class="MsoNormal"> <br>
                                                </p>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                            <div
id="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal">Thanks,
                                                  Peter.  Looks like I
                                                  did miss this at some
                                                  point, so please
                                                  accept my apologies
                                                  for the confusion.</p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal">Generally,
                                                  I"m ok with this, but
                                                  a few thoughts:</p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal">*
                                                  I'm not sure what
                                                  "sponsored" by the
                                                  GNSO means in this
                                                  context.  Maybe we
                                                  could say something
                                                  like "convened" or
                                                  "supported" jointly by
                                                  the GNSO & GAC?<span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span
                                                    style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span
                                                    style="color:red">
                                                    this expression was
                                                    used by ICANN staff
                                                    but I can only agree
                                                    that those you
                                                    suggested are much
                                                    better.<br>
                                                  </span></p>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​Greg:
                                      From my point of view, this
                                      support is predicated on the panel
                                      representing multiple
                                      perspectives.​</div>
                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                      style="margin:0px 0px 0px
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class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
                                          <div>
                                            <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
                                              <div
id="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​</span></p>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                      style="margin:0px 0px 0px
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class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
                                          <div>
                                            <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
                                              <div
id="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                                      style="color:red"></span></p>
                                                </div>
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                                                </div>
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal">*
                                                    I think we need to
                                                    keep the number
                                                    panelists to an
                                                    absolute minimum.<span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span
                                                      style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span
                                                      style="color:red">
                                                      I agree. 3+3
                                                      should be the
                                                      maximum (!).</span>
                                                     If we strive to
                                                    represent all seven
                                                    GNSO SG/Cs, plus
                                                    GAC, plus COE/DPAs,
                                                    then this session
                                                    runs the risk of
                                                    becoming "Death by
                                                    PowerPoint" and
                                                    dosn't leave much
                                                    time for Q&A. 
                                                    To that end, I will
                                                    let Graeme know that
                                                    we are looking for a
                                                    RrSG panelist, but
                                                    would encourage them
                                                    to reach out to Jim
                                                    Galvin and see if he
                                                    is comfortable
                                                    representing
                                                    industry generally.
                                                    Or if we need
                                                    another CPH person
                                                    that can wear both
                                                    "hats."<span
                                                      style="color:rgb(31,73,125)">
                                                    </span> <span
                                                      style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span
                                                      style="color:red">
                                                      not necessarily as
                                                      Jim could
                                                      represent it quite
                                                      well, I am sure.
                                                      (Being said that
                                                      we would have
                                                      preferred more
                                                      focus on the
                                                      industry itself
                                                      and to the
                                                      different players
                                                      as they are the
                                                      first level data
                                                      controllers. All
                                                      NCPH and GAC
                                                      related groups are
                                                      secondary only)
                                                      But if the
                                                      internal dynamic
                                                      of GNSO is as
                                                      such, be it, but
                                                      in this case we
                                                      suggest Becky Burr
                                                      to be on the panel
                                                      (and not being
                                                      moderator).</span></p>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
                                      ​ICANN and the GNSO are not merely
                                      about "the industry." If you
                                      wanted an industry facing program
                                      or a dialogue only with "the
                                      industry", the appropriate place
                                      for that would be the GDD (Global
                                      Domains Division) Summit.​  As the
                                      President of an "NCPH related
                                      group" I can assure you that our
                                      concerns about data protection and
                                      privacy are not "secondary" -- at
                                      least not to us and our
                                      stakeholder community.  This
                                      further shows the problem of
                                      "perspectives" as this panel is
                                      being planned.</div>
                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
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                                          <div>
                                            <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
                                              <div
id="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                                      style="color:red">
                                                    </span></p>
                                                </div>
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                                                </div>
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal">*
                                                    Similarly, I think
                                                    the NCPH should
                                                    strive for ~2
                                                    panelists.  Again, I
                                                    apologize if the
                                                    discussions were
                                                    already headed in
                                                    this direction, as I
                                                    have lost track of
                                                    the names proposed
                                                    in this thread.<span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span
                                                      style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span
                                                      style="color:red">
                                                      I really think
                                                      that if CPH has
                                                      one panellist NCPH
                                                      should also has to
                                                      have 1 only
                                                      because of the
                                                      arguments
                                                      expressed above.</span></p>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​Greg:
                                      Peter, you may not know it (or
                                      perhaps you may) but the NCPH is
                                      an umbrella over two parts of the
                                      GNSO -- the Commercial Stakeholder
                                      Group and the Non-Commercial
                                      Stakeholder Group.  There is no
                                      valid way that a single panelist
                                      could provide the sharply
                                      different perspectives of these
                                      two stakeholder groups.  Even
                                      having a single panelist
                                      representative the different
                                      perspectives of IP stakeholders,
                                      ISPs and Connectivity Providers,
                                      and ​the business user community
                                      is a stretch (which hopefully
                                      would be mitigated by Q&A).  I
                                      would say that if only panelist
                                      came from the NCPH, they should
                                      come from the CSG, as we would
                                      offer a more distinguishable
                                      perspective, but frankly that
                                      would be unfair to the
                                      Non-Commercial side of the house
                                      (which itself includes a range of
                                      viewpoints), and I don't want to
                                      be unfair to the NCSG and its
                                      constituencies either.</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                      style="margin:0px 0px 0px
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                                          <div>
                                            <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
                                              <div
id="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"></span></p>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span style="color:red">
                                                      Therefore our
                                                      suggestion for the
                                                      panel: Becky Burr,
                                                      Thomas Schneider,
                                                      Jim Galvin </span></p>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
                                      ​This neatly includes the
                                      contracted parties (Registries and
                                      Registrars) and excluded the
                                      commercial private sector
                                      represented in the NCPH.  This is
                                      not acceptable.  (Which is why
                                      James, as Chair of the GNSO,
                                      wisely suggested 2 panelists from
                                      the NCPH.)​</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">This
                                      description was provided by Peter:</div>
                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                      style="margin:0px 0px 0px
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                                      rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                                      <div lang="EN-GB">
                                        <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
                                          <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
                                            <div
id="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                                    style="color:red"> </span></p>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                            <div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"
                                                  style="text-align:justify;text-indent:35.4pt"><span
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif">A community-wide event will be
                                                    organised on 13
                                                    March 2017 under the
                                                    form of a High
                                                    Interest Topic
                                                    “sponsored” by the
                                                    Generic Names
                                                    Supporting
                                                    Organization (GNSO)
                                                    Council (and
                                                    possibly by the
                                                    Governmental
                                                    Advisory Committee
                                                    (GAC) as well) which
                                                    will enable the
                                                    participation of
                                                    interested ICANN
                                                    communities. </span></p>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
                                      ​We are an interested ICANN
                                      community and we have been seeking
                                      to participate and/or to have
                                      participation from the
                                      enforcement/cybercrime/infring<wbr>ement
                                      side of the roster.  So far with
                                      no success.</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​</div>
                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                      style="margin:0px 0px 0px
                                      0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
                                      rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                                      <div lang="EN-GB">
                                        <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
                                          <div
class="m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
                                            <div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"
                                                  style="text-align:justify;text-indent:35.4pt"><span
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif">The session could be jointly opened
                                                    by the CEO of ICANN
                                                    Board and the
                                                    Director of
                                                    Information Society
                                                    and Action against
                                                    Crime of the Council
                                                    of Europe. During
                                                    the session the
                                                    United Nations’
                                                    Special Rapporteur
                                                    on the right to
                                                    privacy, the
                                                    co-Chair of the
                                                    Article 29 Working
                                                    Group and the
                                                    European Data
                                                    Protection
                                                    Supervisor together
                                                    with high level
                                                    representatives of
                                                    registries’ group,
                                                    the registrars’
                                                    group and the GAC
                                                    will address in 10
                                                    minutes each the
                                                    above mentioned
                                                    topics. During the
                                                    session the
                                                    involvement of the
                                                    audience will be
                                                    guaranteed by an
                                                    open mike slot.</span></p>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">I
                                                    think during the
                                                    last days, weeks we
                                                    have reached an
                                                    agreement on Ms
                                                    Becky Burr
                                                    moderating the panel
                                                    and having James
                                                    Galvin as
                                                    representative for
                                                    registries’ group
                                                    (both seemed to
                                                    agree on that). If
                                                    we follow this logic
                                                    we would need one
                                                    representative from
                                                    the GAC and one from
                                                    registrars’ group.
                                                    (We previously </span></p>
                                                <div
                                                  class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">​P​</div>
                                                suggested that the chair
                                                of these communities
                                                could be invited to
                                                speak under these two
                                                slots).</div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​<font
                                        color="#000000">Greg: Not to
                                        sound like a broken record, but
                                        this emphasis on including the
                                        contracted parties to the
                                        exclusion of the non-contracted
                                        parties really runs counter to
                                        multistakeholder sensibilities.</font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><font
                                        color="#000000"><br>
                                      </font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><font
                                        color="#000000">If the emphasis
                                        is on "high level
                                        representatives" and "chairs" I
                                        would be willing to join the
                                        panel as the chair of my
                                        community, though we may have
                                        better candidates on substance
                                        (including Vicky, who is our
                                        vice chair).​<br>
                                      </font></div>
                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
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                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">In
                                      response to my email asking what
                                      her goals for the panel were (and
                                      which stated much of what I've
                                      restated above), ​Stephanie Perrin
                                      wrote: <span>Peter and the COE
                                        are organizing this.  I will let
                                        them explain the goals.  In my
                                        personal view....data protection
                                        commissioners are not present at
                                        ICANN.  The dialogue has been
                                        anything but robust, although
                                        they have been attempting to
                                        engage for many many years.</span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span><br>
                                      </span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="arial, helvetica,
                                        sans-serif">Vicky responded:</font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default">
                                      <blockquote
                                        style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
                                        <p class="MsoNormal">It is clear
                                          we need additional
                                          perspectives to make this a
                                          robust panel.  I think james
                                          is a good addition and  we
                                          also need someone with
                                          Cathrin's perspective,</p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"><br>
                                        </p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal">Greg: We
                                          still need that perspective.</p>
                                      </blockquote>
                                    </div>
                                    <div>
                                      <div class="gmail_default"
                                        style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​Peter
                                        responded with COE's goals:</div>
                                      <div class="gmail_default"
                                        style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div>
                                        <div class="gmail_default"
                                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:16px;text-align:justify;text-indent:47.2px">The
                                            panellists will be invited
                                            to exchange views on the
                                            privacy and data protection
                                            implications of processing
                                            of WHOIS data, third party
                                            access to personal data and
                                            the issue of accountability
                                            for the processing of
                                            personal data. The expected
                                            outcome of the event is a
                                            better mutual understanding
                                            of the underlying questions
                                            related to the protection of
                                            privacy and personal data
                                            and the strengthening of an
                                            open and inclusive dialogue
                                            on these issues, to be
                                            carried on anytime deemed
                                            necessary.</span>​</div>
                                        <br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div class="gmail_default"
                                        style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
                                        We are among those "third
                                        parties" and we are seeking to
                                        be included in an open and
                                        inclusive dialogue, and to
                                        include the perspective of
                                        government as among those "third
                                        parties" as well.  I'm not sure
                                        why this has become quite so
                                        difficult.​</div>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​Prior
                                      to that Peter wrote: ​</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"><br>
                                      </span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt">I
                                        really don’t want to hurt
                                        anybody personally, I find this
                                        exchange of mails rather odd
                                        [discussion of the importance of
                                        EDPS, correction of Ms.
                                        Bauer-Bulst's characterization
                                        of the EDPS as a "body that
                                        advises,"  and the relative
                                        ranks of various potential
                                        panelists removed for space]</span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"><br>
                                      </span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="verdana, sans-serif"
                                        color="#000000">Greg: I'm not
                                        sure why you find this exchange
                                        of emails "rather odd", but
                                        perhaps it traces back to the
                                        mismatch between a
                                        community-planned HIT and a
                                        panel planned by the CoE.  These
                                        emails are our attempts at
                                        community planning -- again an
                                        essentially multistakeholder
                                        effort.</font></div>
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​In
                                      response to Stephanie's question
                                      to me "Who would you propose?"
                                      (responding to my view that we
                                      n​eeded a panel that represented
                                      multiple perspectives), Peter
                                      wrote:</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><br>
                                      </span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif">I think we all are on the same
                                        page...therefore I suggest to
                                        include Becky Burr to this
                                        panel. She was recommended by
                                        other constituencies as well so
                                        if you agree we can move along.</span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><br>
                                      </span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="verdana, sans-serif">Greg:
                                        I respect Becky immensely and
                                        already said she was a great
                                        choice on many counts.  Yet, the
                                        response above misses my point
                                        -- that we need perspectives
                                        beyond data protection officials
                                        and "the industry."</font></div>
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                                                          <p
                                                          class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:36pt"> </p>
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                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​Any
                                      more would be piling on, but I
                                      wanted to note just a couple more
                                      things.  One was Peter's
                                      suggestion that <i
style="text-align:justify;text-indent:35.4pt;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span
                                          style="color:black">The
                                          current state of preparation
                                          would imply the following
                                          meetings</span></i><span
                                        style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span
style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black">      </span><i
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span
                                          style="color:black">a session
                                          with the GAC plenary,</span></i><span
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span
style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black">      </span><i
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span
                                          style="color:black">a working
                                          lunch with the Board,</span></i><span
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span
style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black">      </span><i
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span
                                          style="color:black">community
                                          wide afternoon session
                                          possibly in the format of an
                                          “High Interest Topic”.</span></i><span
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span
style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black">      </span><i
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span
                                          style="color:black">alternatively
                                          or subsequently a joint
                                          meeting with GNSO Council and
                                          ccNSO Council </span></i><span
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span
style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black">      </span><i
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span
                                          style="color:black">bilateral
                                          meetings with NSCG, NCUC and
                                          ALAC</span></i></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><i
style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span
                                          style="color:black"><br>
                                        </span></i></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">​Greg:
                                      I would suggest that a bilateral
                                      meeting with the CSG (and not
                                      merely with the more <i>simpatico</i>​
                                      community groups) should be
                                      considered, to say the least.  We
                                      would be honored to have such a
                                      meeting (and we don't bite).</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Peter
                                      wrote, in response to Vicky:</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"
                                        lang="EN-US">Separately, please
                                        note I anticipate having some
                                        additional suggestions for
                                        consideration for this panel by
                                        the end of next week.</span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"
                                        lang="EN-US"> </span><span
                                        style="font-size:11pt;font-family:wingdings;color:red"
                                        lang="EN-US">à</span><span
                                        style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:red"
                                        lang="EN-US">Please do so, but
                                        you have to understand that it
                                        is rather strange that 1 month
                                        away of the event we don’t know
                                        who the speakers would be. We
                                        have also made suggestions which
                                        we believe enjoy the support of
                                        many in GNSO (and beyond)
                                        fellows and follows the idea of
                                        multi-stakeholderism and cover
                                        the main issues Victoria
                                        suggested us to take into
                                        account including third party
                                        access to data. I would
                                        recommend to consider those and
                                        come back to us as quickly as
                                        you can…</span><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:red"
                                        lang="EN-US"><br>
                                      </span></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="verdana, sans-serif"
                                        color="#000000">Greg: Given that
                                        this session was only suggested
                                        as a High Interest Topic on
                                        January 23, it's not so strange
                                        that we have not finalized the
                                        speakers list.  We began
                                        discussing the other HIT
                                        sessions quite a bit earlier. 
                                        That said, the sooner we can
                                        bring the necessary people with
                                        the necessary perspectives and
                                        the necessary protocol-sensitive
                                        rank (apologies for our
                                        insensitivity to protocol
                                        concerns; I guess Americans
                                        don't do well with rank, and one
                                        of the refreshing aspects of the
                                        ICANN milieu is that rank is
                                        generally absent from our
                                        considerations).</font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="verdana, sans-serif"><br>
                                      </font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="verdana, sans-serif">I
                                        will once again emphasize that
                                        GNSO is itself a
                                        multistakeholder organization so
                                        having "the support of many in
                                        GNSO" does not mean that your
                                        suggestions have the support of
                                        our part of the GNSO (hence, our
                                        attempts since late last
                                        month).  Leaving out the
                                        commercial sector does not quite
                                        follow the idea of
                                        multistakeholderism....</font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="verdana, sans-serif"><br>
                                      </font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="verdana, sans-serif">I
                                        would love nothing more for us
                                        to resolve this to our
                                        collective and individual
                                        satisfaction and move on.  I
                                        look forward to doing so.</font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><font
                                        face="verdana, sans-serif"><br>
                                      </font></div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default">Best
                                      Regards,</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default">Greg
                                      Shatan</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default">President</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default">Intellectual
                                      Property Constituency</div>
                                    <div class="gmail_default"
                                      style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                                    </div>
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                          <br>
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