<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra">Hi Stephanie,</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra">I think what Farzaneh wanted to highlight is that NCSG made a meeting request for NCSG-DPA session but you are saying that DPA will go to RDS session instead?</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra">Best,</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra">Rafik<br>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">2017-02-15 14:12 GMT+09:00 Stephanie Perrin <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca</a>></span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Wednesday is still our
day alone to use as we see fit. Chuck is trying to get Mr
Cannatucci to attend our RDS meeting on Wednesday., I will
forward that thread to you as well. All the other sessions
are monday</font></font><br>
</p><div><div class="h5">
<br>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731moz-cite-prefix">On 2017-02-14 23:59, farzaneh badii
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Hi Stephanie,</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">We both asked Maryam to
follow up on NCSG session with the UN special rapp. I think
would be helpful that Tapani also follows up since it's an
NCSG request and we still don't see it on the schedule. Did I
interpret it wrong that you said Chuck was planning to turn
that into a GNSO meeting. Is the wednesday session only NCSG
meeting wtih the UN rapp?</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Farzaneh </font></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at 11:23 PM,
Stephanie Perrin <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.<wbr>utoronto.ca</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">What
happened is this:</font></font></p>
<ul>
<li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">GAC was
asked to sponsor, never got it done</font></font></li>
<li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">GNSO was
asked to sponsor, proposed instead to replace a
lapsed HIT with this panel</font></font></li>
<li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Invitations
went out for the opening day of the conference
(they had to, these are busy guys) <br>
</font></font></li>
<li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">IPC
weighed in demanding balanced HIT style panels
(Victoria sheckler their person on this)<br>
</font></font></li>
<li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Side
meetings have apparently been arranged</font></font></li>
<li><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">only guy
available for our meeting on Wednesday is UN
Special Rapporteur for privacy (grateful for this,
this is a big deal and I am trying to get his
latest book read prior to the event </font></font></li>
</ul>
<p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Last version
I saw of the schedule we did not have a session.
You were checking on that. Chuck Gomes was asking
for time for the PDP on RDS but Monday is only day,
he is trying for 8 am breakfast meeting.</font></font></p>
<p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">cheers Steph<br>
</font></font></p>
<div>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731h5">
<p><br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116moz-cite-prefix">On
2017-02-14 23:09, farzaneh badii wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Hi
Stephanie,</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Can you
clarify something for me? Is this the </span><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Cross- </font><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Community </font><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Discussion </span><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">wi<wbr>th
Data </span><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Protection </span><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Commissioners</span><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">?<wbr> </span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">If so,
didn't we also submit a session request ( NCSG
request)? Did that turn into the above
session? Where did this session come from and
where is NCSG session?</span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</span></div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Farzaneh
</font></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Feb 14, 2017 at
10:43 PM, Stephanie Perrin <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoront<wbr>o.ca</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<p>I am biting my tongue on this. As some
of you heard, I raised this with Goran.
I am tempted to just slide it along to
him. With of course a mention of how the
GAC and ICANN staff sat on this from
Hyderabad until mid January.</p>
<p>Suggestions welcome. Pissed off, am I. <br>
</p>
<p>Steph<br>
</p>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-forward-container"><br>
<br>
-------- Forwarded Message --------
<table class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-email-headers-table" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<th align="RIGHT" nowrap valign="BASELINE">Subject: </th>
<td>Re: ICANN58 Data Protection
Session Planning</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th align="RIGHT" nowrap valign="BASELINE">Date: </th>
<td>Tue, 14 Feb 2017 21:52:54 -0500</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th align="RIGHT" nowrap valign="BASELINE">From: </th>
<td>Greg Shatan <a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com" target="_blank"><gregshatanipc@gmail.com></a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th align="RIGHT" nowrap valign="BASELINE">To: </th>
<td>KIMPIAN Peter <a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:Peter.KIMPIAN@coe.int" target="_blank"><Peter.KIMPIAN@coe.int></a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th align="RIGHT" nowrap valign="BASELINE">CC: </th>
<td>Victoria Sheckler <a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:vsheckler@riaa.com" target="_blank"><vsheckler@riaa.com></a>,
James M. Bladel <a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jbladel@godaddy.com" target="_blank"><jbladel@godaddy.com></a>,
<a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com" target="_blank">kathy@kathykleiman.com</a>
<a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com" target="_blank"><kathy@kathykleiman.com></a>,
<a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:donna.austin@neustar.biz" target="_blank">donna.austin@neustar.biz</a>
<a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:donna.austin@neustar.biz" target="_blank"><donna.austin@neustar.biz></a>,
<a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:heather.forrest@acu.edu.au" target="_blank">heather.forrest@acu.edu.au</a>
<a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:heather.forrest@acu.edu.au" target="_blank"><heather.forrest@acu.edu.au></a>,
Stephanie Perrin <a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" target="_blank"><stephanie.perrin@mail.utoront<wbr>o.ca></a>,
KWASNY Sophie <a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:Sophie.KWASNY@coe.int" target="_blank"><Sophie.KWASNY@coe.int></a>,
Wilson, Christopher <a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:cwilson@21cf.com" target="_blank"><cwilson@21cf.com></a>,
Tony Holmes <a class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:tonyarholmes@btinternet.com" target="_blank"><tonyarholmes@btinternet.com></a></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<br>
<br>
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">All,</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">
<div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font face="verdana, sans-serif"><i>First,
apologies for the length of this
message and a tone that is more
strident than I intend it to
be. Another pass through this
email could smooth the rough
edges, but it is 2:45 am in
Reykjavik and I have a 7:15
breakfast meeting, so my
capacity is exhausted (and so am
I). Please read this with a
friendly, collegial tone in mind
and indulge me where I have
failed to have the tone of the
text match my desire to be a
good working partner (and to
"disagree without being
disagreeable") even where our
perspectives may differ. (As
partial explanation, my sport of
choice in my youth was rugby ("a
ruffian's game played by
gentlemen"), while fencing
probably would have been more
apropos....)</i></font></div>
<div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font face="verdana, sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">I am quite concerned with where
we are in this discussion. There
are either some substantial
misunderstandings about what this
session, as a "High Interest
Topic", is supposed to be -- or
there is an apparent intent to
exclude perspectives that will
keep this from being a celebration
of data protection principles. I
hope it's the former, but even
that is unfortunate.</span><br>
</div>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Perhaps
the root of the problem is combining
the original idea for a CoE-organized
presentation with the High Interest
Topic (HIT) concept -- or perhaps that
just highlighted the inherent problem
with the session. HIT doesn't just
refer to a level of interest -- it's
supposed to be a community-generated
proposal that is then planned and
presented with multistakeholder
participation (and <u>not</u> merely
by the proposing organization). One
of the problems we had with the last
round of HITs was a proposal for a HIT
session to be planned and presented by
a single part of the community,
largely consisting of a presentation
by one of its members and only minor
roles for any sector not sympathetic
to the views of this member and
community group. This was
inconsistent with the idea that the
proposing organization does not
control the content of a HIT session.
Fortunately, the original planners
agreed to to expand to a more diverse
planning team, with the result being a
more diverse panel and a very lively
and well-received session. When
community leaders got on the phone to
consider this round of HITs, we wanted
to avoid a replay of this situation
(although it ended well enough).</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">When
this data protection session was
brought to the community leaders group
as a late suggestion for one of the
HIT slots, I was concerned we might be
heading for a replay, so the IPC
specified that one of our members
(Vicky) should be added to the
planning group (knowing that at least
one other constituency shared very
similar concerns). Unlike the last
time, where we were able to get a hand
on the tiller and help turn the ship,
I've found our attempts to be largely
rebuffed. This has been increasingly
frustrating.</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">I'd
like to respond to some of the
specific statements on this thread
since I last had an opportunity to
respond:</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">Vicky
wrote: </div>
<span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt">I
don’t see here (but I am also
sleep deprived) which panelist
will represent public safety /
transparency / enforcement
concerns.</span></div>
<div class="gmail_quote"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"><br>
</span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color:rgb(80,0,80)"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">Peter
responded: </div>
<span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt">Uuhhh,
if you are in US it is quite early
for you…in my sense usually the
governments are responsible and
accountable for the issues you
mentioned, therefore it seemed to
me logical that those issues will
be taken care by a representative
of the GAC. Besides that, the PSWG
is a sub-group of the GAC which is
deliberately discussing those
issues you mentioned…</span></div>
<div class="gmail_quote"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"><br>
</span></div>
<div class="gmail_quote"><span style="font-family:calibri,sans-serif"><font color="#000000">
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"><span style="font-size:11pt"></span>Greg:
This misses the point of
Vicky's question and perhaps
misses a fundamental point
about ICANN -- that it is a
multistakeholder organization
and <i>not</i> a multilateral
organization. Governments are
not the only ones concerned
with investigation and
enforcement -- there are also
significant parts of the
private sector deeply engaged
in investigation and
enforcement (and not to put
too fine a point on it, but
IPC (my group and Vicky's
group) represents one of those
parts of the private sector).
As such, at least one voice
from these parts of the
private sector should be
present on the panel. Even
within governments, there are
parts that deal with public
safety and enforcement. The
idea that a representative of
the GAC will provide this
perspective seems mistaken.
As fine a chair as the GAC
chair is, I don't believe this
is his perspective, and the
suggestion this would be
within his brief seemed based
more on protocol than
practicality. As revealed in
this thread, Ms. Bauer-Bulst
is the co-chair of the PSWG,
so would be more on point for
this perspective (though
apparently she is not
sufficiently august to appear
on the panel, even if she is a
Deputy Head of Unit, and not
merely a Team Leader as was
stated earlier in this
exchange).</div>
</font></span></div>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Peter
replied to James Bladel in red
below:</div>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"></div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
<div>
<div style="border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"> <br>
</p>
</div>
</div>
<div id="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks,
Peter. Looks like I
did miss this at some
point, so please
accept my apologies
for the confusion.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Generally,
I"m ok with this, but
a few thoughts:</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">*
I'm not sure what
"sponsored" by the
GNSO means in this
context. Maybe we
could say something
like "convened" or
"supported" jointly by
the GNSO & GAC?<span style="color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span style="color:red">
this expression was
used by ICANN staff
but I can only agree
that those you
suggested are much
better.<br>
</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
From my point of view, this
support is predicated on the panel
representing multiple
perspectives.</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
<div>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
<div id="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
<div>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
<div id="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:red"></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">*
I think we need to
keep the number
panelists to an
absolute minimum.<span style="color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span style="color:red">
I agree. 3+3
should be the
maximum (!).</span>
If we strive to
represent all seven
GNSO SG/Cs, plus
GAC, plus COE/DPAs,
then this session
runs the risk of
becoming "Death by
PowerPoint" and
dosn't leave much
time for Q&A.
To that end, I will
let Graeme know that
we are looking for a
RrSG panelist, but
would encourage them
to reach out to Jim
Galvin and see if he
is comfortable
representing
industry generally.
Or if we need
another CPH person
that can wear both
"hats."<span style="color:rgb(31,73,125)">
</span> <span style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span style="color:red">
not necessarily as
Jim could
represent it quite
well, I am sure.
(Being said that
we would have
preferred more
focus on the
industry itself
and to the
different players
as they are the
first level data
controllers. All
NCPH and GAC
related groups are
secondary only)
But if the
internal dynamic
of GNSO is as
such, be it, but
in this case we
suggest Becky Burr
to be on the panel
(and not being
moderator).</span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
ICANN and the GNSO are not merely
about "the industry." If you
wanted an industry facing program
or a dialogue only with "the
industry", the appropriate place
for that would be the GDD (Global
Domains Division) Summit. As the
President of an "NCPH related
group" I can assure you that our
concerns about data protection and
privacy are not "secondary" -- at
least not to us and our
stakeholder community. This
further shows the problem of
"perspectives" as this panel is
being planned.</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
<div>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
<div id="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:red">
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">*
Similarly, I think
the NCPH should
strive for ~2
panelists. Again, I
apologize if the
discussions were
already headed in
this direction, as I
have lost track of
the names proposed
in this thread.<span style="color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span style="color:red">
I really think
that if CPH has
one panellist NCPH
should also has to
have 1 only
because of the
arguments
expressed above.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
Peter, you may not know it (or
perhaps you may) but the NCPH is
an umbrella over two parts of the
GNSO -- the Commercial Stakeholder
Group and the Non-Commercial
Stakeholder Group. There is no
valid way that a single panelist
could provide the sharply
different perspectives of these
two stakeholder groups. Even
having a single panelist
representative the different
perspectives of IP stakeholders,
ISPs and Connectivity Providers,
and the business user community
is a stretch (which hopefully
would be mitigated by Q&A). I
would say that if only panelist
came from the NCPH, they should
come from the CSG, as we would
offer a more distinguishable
perspective, but frankly that
would be unfair to the
Non-Commercial side of the house
(which itself includes a range of
viewpoints), and I don't want to
be unfair to the NCSG and its
constituencies either.</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
<div>
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
<div id="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:wingdings;color:red">à</span><span style="color:red">
Therefore our
suggestion for the
panel: Becky Burr,
Thomas Schneider,
Jim Galvin </span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
This neatly includes the
contracted parties (Registries and
Registrars) and excluded the
commercial private sector
represented in the NCPH. This is
not acceptable. (Which is why
James, as Chair of the GNSO,
wisely suggested 2 panelists from
the NCPH.)</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">This
description was provided by Peter:</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
<div id="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672compose">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:red"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;text-indent:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif">A community-wide event will be
organised on 13
March 2017 under the
form of a High
Interest Topic
“sponsored” by the
Generic Names
Supporting
Organization (GNSO)
Council (and
possibly by the
Governmental
Advisory Committee
(GAC) as well) which
will enable the
participation of
interested ICANN
communities. </span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
We are an interested ICANN
community and we have been seeking
to participate and/or to have
participation from the
enforcement/cybercrime/infring<wbr>ement
side of the roster. So far with
no success.</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"></div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify;text-indent:35.4pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif">The session could be jointly opened
by the CEO of ICANN
Board and the
Director of
Information Society
and Action against
Crime of the Council
of Europe. During
the session the
United Nations’
Special Rapporteur
on the right to
privacy, the
co-Chair of the
Article 29 Working
Group and the
European Data
Protection
Supervisor together
with high level
representatives of
registries’ group,
the registrars’
group and the GAC
will address in 10
minutes each the
above mentioned
topics. During the
session the
involvement of the
audience will be
guaranteed by an
open mike slot.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">I
think during the
last days, weeks we
have reached an
agreement on Ms
Becky Burr
moderating the panel
and having James
Galvin as
representative for
registries’ group
(both seemed to
agree on that). If
we follow this logic
we would need one
representative from
the GAC and one from
registrars’ group.
(We previously </span></p>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">P</div>
suggested that the chair
of these communities
could be invited to
speak under these two
slots).</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><font color="#000000">Greg: Not to
sound like a broken record, but
this emphasis on including the
contracted parties to the
exclusion of the non-contracted
parties really runs counter to
multistakeholder sensibilities.</font></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><br>
</font></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><font color="#000000">If the emphasis
is on "high level
representatives" and "chairs" I
would be willing to join the
panel as the chair of my
community, though we may have
better candidates on substance
(including Vicky, who is our
vice chair).<br>
</font></div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
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<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">In
response to my email asking what
her goals for the panel were (and
which stated much of what I've
restated above), Stephanie Perrin
wrote: <span>Peter and the COE
are organizing this. I will let
them explain the goals. In my
personal view....data protection
commissioners are not present at
ICANN. The dialogue has been
anything but robust, although
they have been attempting to
engage for many many years.</span></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span><br>
</span></div>
<div><font face="arial, helvetica,
sans-serif">Vicky responded:</font></div>
<div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class="MsoNormal">It is clear
we need additional
perspectives to make this a
robust panel. I think james
is a good addition and we
also need someone with
Cathrin's perspective,</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Greg: We
still need that perspective.</p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Peter
responded with COE's goals:</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:16px;text-align:justify;text-indent:47.2px">The
panellists will be invited
to exchange views on the
privacy and data protection
implications of processing
of WHOIS data, third party
access to personal data and
the issue of accountability
for the processing of
personal data. The expected
outcome of the event is a
better mutual understanding
of the underlying questions
related to the protection of
privacy and personal data
and the strengthening of an
open and inclusive dialogue
on these issues, to be
carried on anytime deemed
necessary.</span></div>
<br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
We are among those "third
parties" and we are seeking to
be included in an open and
inclusive dialogue, and to
include the perspective of
government as among those "third
parties" as well. I'm not sure
why this has become quite so
difficult.</div>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Prior
to that Peter wrote: </div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"><br>
</span></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt">I
really don’t want to hurt
anybody personally, I find this
exchange of mails rather odd
[discussion of the importance of
EDPS, correction of Ms.
Bauer-Bulst's characterization
of the EDPS as a "body that
advises," and the relative
ranks of various potential
panelists removed for space]</span></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"><br>
</span></div>
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif" color="#000000">Greg: I'm not
sure why you find this exchange
of emails "rather odd", but
perhaps it traces back to the
mismatch between a
community-planned HIT and a
panel planned by the CoE. These
emails are our attempts at
community planning -- again an
essentially multistakeholder
effort.</font></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">In
response to Stephanie's question
to me "Who would you propose?"
(responding to my view that we
needed a panel that represented
multiple perspectives), Peter
wrote:</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><br>
</span></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif">I think we all are on the same
page...therefore I suggest to
include Becky Burr to this
panel. She was recommended by
other constituencies as well so
if you agree we can move along.</span></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><br>
</span></div>
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Greg:
I respect Becky immensely and
already said she was a great
choice on many counts. Yet, the
response above misses my point
-- that we need perspectives
beyond data protection officials
and "the industry."</font></div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-m_4485284271700414672WordSection1">
<div class="m_-9038760910269525731m_-1196239896132014116m_-3173739836713035587gmail-m_-6066402398364144317gmail-m_-4559061870864558269gmail-h5">
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:36pt"> </p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Any
more would be piling on, but I
wanted to note just a couple more
things. One was Peter's
suggestion that <i style="text-align:justify;text-indent:35.4pt;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="color:black">The
current state of preparation
would imply the following
meetings</span></i><span style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black"> </span><i style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="color:black">a session
with the GAC plenary,</span></i><span style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black"> </span><i style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="color:black">a working
lunch with the Board,</span></i><span style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black"> </span><i style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="color:black">community
wide afternoon session
possibly in the format of an
“High Interest Topic”.</span></i><span style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black"> </span><i style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="color:black">alternatively
or subsequently a joint
meeting with GNSO Council and
ccNSO Council </span></i><span style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif;color:black">-</span><span style="text-align:justify;font-size:7pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:black"> </span><i style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="color:black">bilateral
meetings with NSCG, NCUC and
ALAC</span></i></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><i style="text-align:justify;font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="color:black"><br>
</span></i></div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg:
I would suggest that a bilateral
meeting with the CSG (and not
merely with the more <i>simpatico</i>
community groups) should be
considered, to say the least. We
would be honored to have such a
meeting (and we don't bite).</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Peter
wrote, in response to Vicky:</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="EN-US">Separately, please
note I anticipate having some
additional suggestions for
consideration for this panel by
the end of next week.</span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)" lang="EN-US"> </span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:wingdings;color:red" lang="EN-US">à</span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:red" lang="EN-US">Please do so, but
you have to understand that it
is rather strange that 1 month
away of the event we don’t know
who the speakers would be. We
have also made suggestions which
we believe enjoy the support of
many in GNSO (and beyond)
fellows and follows the idea of
multi-stakeholderism and cover
the main issues Victoria
suggested us to take into
account including third party
access to data. I would
recommend to consider those and
come back to us as quickly as
you can…</span><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:red" lang="EN-US"><br>
</span></div>
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif" color="#000000">Greg: Given that
this session was only suggested
as a High Interest Topic on
January 23, it's not so strange
that we have not finalized the
speakers list. We began
discussing the other HIT
sessions quite a bit earlier.
That said, the sooner we can
bring the necessary people with
the necessary perspectives and
the necessary protocol-sensitive
rank (apologies for our
insensitivity to protocol
concerns; I guess Americans
don't do well with rank, and one
of the refreshing aspects of the
ICANN milieu is that rank is
generally absent from our
considerations).</font></div>
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">I
will once again emphasize that
GNSO is itself a
multistakeholder organization so
having "the support of many in
GNSO" does not mean that your
suggestions have the support of
our part of the GNSO (hence, our
attempts since late last
month). Leaving out the
commercial sector does not quite
follow the idea of
multistakeholderism....</font></div>
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">I
would love nothing more for us
to resolve this to our
collective and individual
satisfaction and move on. I
look forward to doing so.</font></div>
<div><font face="verdana, sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div>Best
Regards,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Greg
Shatan</div>
<div>President</div>
<div>Intellectual
Property Constituency</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
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<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
</div></div></div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
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