[NCSG-EC] Possible framing of conversation

Thu Jun 8 17:41:21 EEST 2023

Sounds good, Paul!

See you both next week.

	Julf

On 08/06/2023 16:29, Paul McGrady wrote:
> Thanks Julf and Lori.
> 
> I'll throw on some Great Lakes bluntness too.  I don't think email exchanges have worked in the past.  Let's not insist on conditions to meet and discuss items of interest.  Can we agree to set aside the back and forth until then?  Otherwise, it seems likely that both sides will arrive at any meeting further entrenched.  How does that sound to both of you?
> 
> Best,
> Paul
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Johan Helsingius <julf.helsingius at gmail.com>
> Sent: Thursday, June 8, 2023 8:04 AM
> To: Lori Schulman <lschulman at inta.org>; Paul McGrady <paul at elstermcgrady.com>
> Cc: NCSG EC <ncsg-ec at lists.ncsg.is>; ncsg-pc <ncsg-pc at lists.ncsg.is>
> Subject: Re: Possble framing of conversation
> 
> Thanks Lori,
> 
> Apologies in advance for my Nordic bluntness.
> 
> While we understand that the CSG feels strongly about Annex 7, we feel any discussion about is definitely premature at this stage. We might discuss it once we have worked out ways to improve communication and co-operation within the NCP, but considering the current issues in that regard, we feel strongly that discussing removing the major incentive to co-operation between the NCSG and CSG would be counterproductive.
> 
> We don't see the current Annex 7 being flawed. What you see as a problem in 3 years, we see as an opportunity for creating consensus.
> 
> While we are happy to sit down in DC to talk about the general issues of communication and co-operation, we don't believe discussing Annex 7 at this stage would be useful, and we still believe completing the current round of Board Seat 14 nomination as quickly as possible should be our top priority.
> 
> Looking forward to trying to resolve the issue face to face in DC next week - as well as looking forward to seeing you all in a more relaxed social context as well.
> 
>          Julf
> 
> 
> On 08/06/2023 01:21, Lori Schulman wrote:
>> Hi Julf,
>>
>> No problem with using your julf.com address.
>> In terms of the rest, let's wait for the in person discussion.  As we discussed, my stakeholder group feels strongly about not delaying opening Annex 7 to discussion.  We see this issue as tied to the Board Seat 14 nomination and do not wish to delay correcting a flawed agreement.  There is a risk that if we don't apply the same urgency, the review will not get done and we will experience this problem again in 3 years. We can solve both issues in tandem if there is a will do so.  We are not in alignment with NCSG on that point. Hopefully, we can get there or to some reasonable compromise.
>>
>> Looking forward to seeing you all next week in DC.
>>
>> With kind regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Lori Schulman
>> Senior Director, Internet Policy
>> International Trademark Association
>> LSchulman at inta.org
>> inta.org  |  Locations  |  Social Media
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Johan Helsingius <julf.helsingius at gmail.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 7, 2023 6:53 PM
>> To: Lori Schulman <lschulman at inta.org>; paul at elstermcgrady.com
>> Cc: NCSG EC <ncsg-ec at lists.ncsg.is>; ncsg-pc <ncsg-pc at lists.ncsg.is>
>> Subject: Re: Possble framing of conversation
>>
>> Hi Lori, and thanks for getting things started. I will discuss these points with my executive and policy teams. A lot of course depends on definitions - we might have different views on what "well-defined"
>> and "reasonable" means in this context.
>>
>> On the friction points, I think the Board Seat 14 nomination is an immediate priority - I don't think discussing it is in any way premature.
>>
>> I totally agree with as much transparency as possible.
>>
>> Lori, could I ask you to use julf at julf.com as my email address rather than julf.helsingius at gmail.com? I don't check my gmail account as often, and the only reason I use it is that the email system of https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2finta.org&c=E,1,Nfs9o5XfmIO_pyVGJXE52oN8IDAAtO1s7RjcrQuscHoEnOdPtXe7zUAb-pxBVEirh2SGXoIKJRdQViTj-thvYj8Qs3_8iiTpfnj4OhFNLZTTfBbFHm4Tig,,&typo=1 refuses mails from my normal address (but I have no problem receiving your emails), so I have to send from gmail to be able to reach you.
>>
>>        Julf
>>
>>
>> On 07/06/2023 18:38, Lori Schulman wrote:
>>> Hi Paul and Julf,
>>>
>>> Pursuant to earlier email exchanged with Julf, we agreed that it
>>> would be a good idea to develop common House goals that would help
>>> drive an agenda where we are aligned rather than in areas that we have friction.
>>>
>>> Not sure if it is too early for that either.  However, we seem to
>>> agree on the following in terms of priorities for our House and ICANN:
>>>
>>>        1. Implementation of Policy Recommendations (unclog the pipes)
>>>        2. Well-defined holistic review including examining the GNSO
>>>           framework and whether it makes sense
>>>        3. Reasonable and well documented DNS Abuse mitigation procedures
>>>        4. Addressing volunteer workload and burnout
>>>
>>> Identified Friction points which may be premature for discussion:
>>>
>>>    1. Moving on with Board Seat 14 nomination  2. Amending Annex 7  3.
>>> Access to Domain Registration Data (huge hot topic but putting here
>>>       for transparency sake)
>>>
>>> I always like to start discussions by identifying alignment before
>>> friction points. In this case, I am comfortable saying that we are
>>> strongly aligned that all discussions should be transparent.
>>> Confidentiality, if we feel it necessary at times, should be an
>>> exception not a default.
>>>
>>> Looking forward to turning the page.
>>>
>>> <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.inta.org%2f&c
>>> =
>>> E,1,tb2zj9j4cJRe9GR4wxRjYQN3dCxqSxqIUNLFYIPVYLZfdMropoqAEIevdyLxJ6Tje
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Lori Schulman
>>>
>>> Senior Director, Internet Policy
>>>
>>> *International Trademark Association*
>>>
>>> LSchulman at inta.org <mailto:rodonnell at Inta.org?subject=Hello>
>>>
>>> https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2finta.org&c=E,1,89
>>> w
>>> NUJsyqmZ_YH2CwMqWatI2wIJQAk1n7c1b4xMmq9HmPrgyYJWtIGZWSC4NXUb2uAxT3pjk
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>>> c
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>>> s
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>>> b
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>>> s,&typo=1>***|***Social Media
>>> <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.inta.org%2fa
>>> b
>>> out%2fsocial-media%2f&c=E,1,sqW0eovlyf8nriGKyUD9nBqLU-eXPQ5gGymVg7RRI
>>> x
>>> SD_788WyacXUWdrvklcds_0sL306ywJVe2ANqKaEcAkvPRJ2Ff7W_ghx1_N_56HMr4enz
>>> _
>>> gTI,&typo=1>
>>>
> This email originated from outside the firm. Please use caution.