<div dir="ltr">I fully agree with Milton, this seems like the most reasonable way forward.<div><br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Best,</span></div><div dir="ltr"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">-Michael</font><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 7:21 PM Mueller, Milton L <<a href="mailto:milton@gatech.edu">milton@gatech.edu</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Nadira:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">A formally designated “working party” with “representatives” from different silos is not the way to go, in my opinion, particularly when some representatives
have already said they do not even support the whole endeavor. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">The onus is on the people who want change to propose specific changes in an amended charter. Let them propose such changes, then expose them to everyone. Once
that happens we can have a more substantive debate about what’s good or bad about those proposed changes. At that point, those who currently oppose any changes can see whether any modifications of the proposal would make it acceptable to them. Or they can
just vote against it. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">That’s the simplest, fastest and fairest way to deal with this.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Dr. Milton L Mueller<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Georgia Institute of Technology<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">School of Public Policy<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><a href="https://internetgovernance.org/" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">Internet Governance Project</span></a>
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> Nadira Alaraj <<a href="mailto:nadira.araj@gmail.com" target="_blank">nadira.araj@gmail.com</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 28, 2020 1:11 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Mueller, Milton L <<a href="mailto:milton@gatech.edu" target="_blank">milton@gatech.edu</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@listserv.syr.edu" target="_blank">NCSG-DISCUSS@listserv.syr.edu</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Follow Up and Further Reflections on Consolidating NCSG, NCUC and NPOC<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Dear All,<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I’m here again suggesting to form a working party with equal representatives from the three bodies to formally analyzing the proposal of merger from all its aspects. <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The Chairs of NCSG/NCUC/NPOC with consultation of their community to decide if they wanted to go ahead discussing the merger or not. <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I don’t see the discussions over the mailing lists lead anywhere. <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Best wishes <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Nadira<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 7:54 PM Mueller, Milton L <<a href="mailto:milton@gatech.edu" target="_blank">milton@gatech.edu</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<blockquote style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">That’s right Arsene. Some of our most active members (e.g., Amr) refuse to join either constituency.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> NCSG-Discuss <<a href="mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU" target="_blank">NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Arsène Tungali<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 28, 2020 12:01 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU" target="_blank">NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Follow Up and Further Reflections on Consolidating NCSG, NCUC and NPOC</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">We also have here folks who are only members of the NCSG, Dorothy!<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Jul 28, 2020, 3:44 PM dorothy g <<a href="mailto:dgdorothydg@gmail.com" target="_blank">dgdorothydg@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">So the idea is to just have NCSG, no more NPOC and NCUC. So if the group persists in going in the consolidation direction the participation in the group to engage with ICANN should
be 2 from NPOC and 2 from NCUC. I do not get the point of any participation from the umbrella group as everyone there is from either NPOC or NCUC. If we have definitional problems all we need to do is to provide a clear standard definition. Your argument
seems to tend to the dissolution of NPOC as you explain the logic for setting it up no longer exists. NPOC members may have a different view. I just wish we could focus on getting people to participate more effectively. Merging will not in my view solve that
fundamental problem.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">best<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 2:02 AM Sam Lanfranco <<a href="mailto:lanfran@yorku.ca" target="_blank">lanfran@yorku.ca</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">I would like to express my appreciation for the thoughtful comments, both pro and con, made with regard to my proposal
that we review the existing structures within NCSG, and explore if there are efficiency and effectiveness gains from a possible redesign under one administrative structure.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">I would like to add some observations. First, NCSG/NCUC/NPOC is unique among the ICANN constituencies. Individual
engagement in the other constituencies is usually part of a job and one is accountable to one’s employer. When we represent an organization, as I do, we rarely receive material support (income, travel, accommodations. We may be only loosely accountable for
the positions we take in policy development and other ICANN business, expected to work on behalf of the public interest.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">We occupy a special position in ICANN’s multistakeholder model. Virtually all the other stakeholder groups (including
GAC) have a strong material self-interest in ICANN’s policies and practices, tempered with a social enterprise commitment to the public good. For the troika, the priorities tend to be reversed. We work on behalf of the public good, while remaining aware of
the self-interests of our organizations, or our individual self-interest. </span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Not only are we different, our presence is essential to ICANN’s commitment to a multistakeholder model. On the three/four
legged ICANN multistakeholder stool there is the contracted-parties leg, the non-contracted-parties leg, the troika as a fragile third leg, and GAC, in its special position, as a possible fourth leg. As ICANN seeks to strengthen its multistakeholder model
(MSM) we should have a dialogue with them around ways we and they can strengthen the troika’s leg, strengthen our role in ICANNs affairs, and improve the effectiveness of ICANN’s material support for us. We should go beyond general MSM policy development and
draft document comments. </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">In terms of our volunteer resources and ICANN’s material support it is worth again remembering why NPOC was spun off
from NCUC, with NCSG being formed as the umbrella group. About a decade ago large global NGOs were afraid of unauthorized and possibly fraudulent uses of their names in the DNS space, and NPOC was created to give them a venue for their concerns within ICANN.
However, from the very start those large global NGOs decided to lobby ICANN more directly and leave NPOC, NCSG, and NCUC only as commentators in the process.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Trying to explain the differences between NCGS, NCUC and NPOC to prospective members, and to those outside ICANN who
are engaged in DNS issues, is not easy. It does not help in recruiting members nor does it expand volunteer resources. Staffing three effectively similar administrative structures with volunteers in not easy. Equally difficult is to answer the question “What
is lost if the troika consolidates into one administrative structure?”</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">The troika has a core of dedicated and hard-working volunteers who reflect the rule that no matter the size of the
organization, about 20% of the members do 80% of the work. Here those who do most of the work are overworked. With more members on board and engaged in policy development we could do more, more equitably share the work, and make a bigger contribution to ICANN’s
mission and vision, while serving the public interest.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">There are several directions in which this discussion can be taken. I suggest that one would be to have a three person
group (NCSG, NCUC, NPOC) engage in a conversation with ICANN that explores the levels of ICANN support, the modes of ICANN support, and areas where those resources could be used more effectively in the troika’s role in ICANN’s work. It would of course make
no decisions but would inform us of the concerns and ideas exchanged. At the same time we should not just list, but also carefully weigh the benefits and costs an administrative consolidation.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Sam Lanfranco, NPOC</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><br clear="all">
<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">--
<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">stay well, kind regards<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Dorothy Gordon<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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