<html><body><font face="Tahoma" size="2">
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#990000">I am offering my perspective here, to help stir the pot in
the dialogue. </font></p><font color="#990000">
</font><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#990000">While the mission and vision of ICANN is the security and
stability of the DNS, the prime task for all of its stakeholder constituencies,
including us, is multistakeholder engagement in the ICANN/DNS policy
development process, including working groups, draft document refinement, and
issues around implementation.</font></p><font color="#990000">
</font><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#990000">Covid-19 today, and cost or environmental considerations
down the road, may restrict future ICANN plans for multiple annual face-to-face
conferences. When considering responses to that, the effectiveness of
alternatives should be assessed in terms of performance around that
prime task, with travel logistics a secondary concern. </font></p><font color="#990000">
</font><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#990000">It would be worth reflecting on the past 5-10 literal ICANN
conferences and assessing their performance in terms of that prime task, and
asking how much of the other activity at conferences could, and should, be done
more effectively more asynchronously and in a more blended virtual/literal
space venue. </font></p><font color="#990000">
</font><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#990000">Looking around at other organizations with a global scope or
mandate it is hard to find one that sees the necessity of multiple annual global
conferences. Those with multiple regional conferences tend to either focus more
on the regional context of their global mandate or operate in a more structured
federated model. </font></p><font color="#990000">
</font><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#990000">We should be looking more at effectiveness and efficiency,
and less at the complications of travel logistics, when assessing where ICANN
should be gong with its conference strategy.</font></p><font color="#990000">
</font><p class="MsoNormal"><font color="#990000">Sam L, NPOC/NCSG</font></p>
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<![endif]--><br><blockquote style="border-left: solid 2px #000000; margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px">---- Original Message ----<br><b>From</b>: Stephanie E Perrin <stephanie@DIGITALDISCRETION.CA><br><b>To</b>: NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU<br><b>Sent</b>: Wed, Jun 24, 2020, 12:23 AM<br><b>Subject</b>: Re: Draft Proposal for Phased Return to Face-to-Face Meetings<br><br>
<p>I was hoping we could do that in the discussions with Matt Shears
who is coming to our meeting....</p>
<p>It seems to me the framework for moving forward is pretty basic
still. We may need to build on this, we will be a whole year with
no face to face meetings, it is a major loss....</p>
<p>cheers SP<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2020-06-24 12:11 a.m., Bruna Martins
dos Santos wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:CADAEEV08G3OUa3SKFdhbYBYW8zJkC3KwW8Ery_bQacW06JqjCQ@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">Hey all,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>This topic is being discussed at the ccNSO and GNSO
councils meeting right now and, by the looks of it, the
discussion of the framework is at its initial stages
throughout the community. <br>
<br>
Maybe it would be interesting to have a short discussion about
this at the NSCG Open Meeting later this week, shortly after
the <i><a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="https://68.schedule.icann.org/meetings/R2oKcfymPMACChq3j#/?limit=10&sortByFields[0]=isPinned&sortByFields[1]=lastActivityAt&sortByOrders[0]=-1&sortByOrders[1]=-1" moz-do-not-send="true">ICANN and COVID-19 - Advancing
Policy Work in the Current Environment</a> </i>Plenary
Session. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>best, </div>
<div>Bruna </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 1:49
AM Raphael Beauregard-Lacroix <<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:rbeauregardlacroix@gmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true">rbeauregardlacroix@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">Hi Steph (and Sam)
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Your points are good, but what I'm putting forward here
is the necessity of understanding what the actual issues
are and how the solutions we think about help us move
forward on those issues. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Visas, flight durations, and flight costs (and also
lack of engagement on the long term) are all issues... and
regional public meetings are a solution to those issues in
specific circumstances only, not accross the board.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>There are plenty of examples around the world of
restrictive visa policies within a same region. Also,
flight costs/duration may not make sense in large
countries, for example. I can already imagine the
absurdity of a supported travel living on the US/Canada
east coast being flown by ICANN to Vancouver at a same or
greater price because that is the "regional meeting"
versus attending the European meeting in London. Besides,
reasonably fast/efficient travel other than by plane is
possible, and potentially safer in the current
circumstances, only in certain parts of the world. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The way I see it, confined spaces are, and will be, a
health concern, may they be planes or conference centers.
So people who cannot or do not want to fly <i>at all - </i> or
attend any in-person conference, for that matter - should
have an alternative; a meaningful online experience. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>In a context where flying is an option, as well as
conferencing in person, people who can/want to fly but do
not have the means, because of the circumstances, should
at least be supported at the same level as they were
before the epidemic. And there's even a case for more
support, especially for us, given that many of our
non-supported travelers actually travel on their own
money. Others may also be facing travel budget cuts from
their organizations. So why not buff the transportation
aspect of travel support (either increasing support of
already supported travels, and/or broadening the base and
supporting more travelers)? That seems to me to be the
straightforward solution, for that problem. It might even
be cheaper than setting up regional meetings - I can't
remember the numbers in this years financial doc, but I'm
quite sure it's something that is at least worth
discussing.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So we are left with everything in between; people who
cannot or do not want to fly too long, may that be for
health reasons, or both health and money reasons (if its
just money, then see above) They might indeed benefit from
a regional format, given the "right" circumstances, in the
"right" region... </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>And unsurprisingly in all that, I believe those who
would get actual benefits from regional meetings - shorter
and cheaper flights, maybe an easier time with visas - are
those who already have those benefits anyway, and who also
have, in general, the financial means to fund their
travels - read Europeans, and to some extent N. Americans
and some part of E. Asia/Pacific (I insist on the "in
general"). I think it's important to be conscious of that
too, and make sure we listen (and reach out if need be) to
those we are supposed to be "helping" with those plans
before designing them. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So I guess I'm not entirely against the idea, but I'm
not convinced that we have either identified correctly all
our problems (and their extent,) nor that a regional
meeting would be a solution for those we have, or we
believe may have. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Nadira: about your point on health insurance, I presume
Org deems it too costly to insure even the supported
participants... I have no idea how valid such an argument
would be from a financial perspective, but that's
something we could inquire upon if it has not been done
before. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Have a nice day,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at
8:23 AM Stephanie E Perrin <<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" moz-do-not-send="true">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p>I agree with most of your thoughts on this Raphael.
My worry is that when we start returning to face to
face meetings, our members in some countries will have
even more problems trying to get visas than they have
had before. I also think there will be reluctance,
regardless of any safety precautions, to get on 12-18
hour flights. So local travel might be more
attractive for a number of reasons, and if we invested
the money in decent connectivity, we could have a
linked meeting. Finally, I wonder what ICANN is
willing to spend on travel....flights are going to be
more expensive, and many airlines are going to be out
of business, so ICANN travel may have severe
restrictions. Regional hubs are not optimal, but we
are not living in optimal times for face to face
conferences.</p>
<p>Kind regards</p>
<p>Stephanie Perrin<br>
</p>
<div>On 2020-06-13 1:25 p.m., Raphael Beauregard-Lacroix
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Hi all,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>A few thoughts:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
I think the regional model is not a bad idea on
paper, but when it comes to public meetings, I am
having a hard time figuring out the problem it
solves, besides that of limitations on the size of
indoor gatherings imposed by public authorities. And
even then, given that we can expect a myriad rules
on the matter from each and every public health
authority, how feasible would it be to "plan"
regionally-split public meetings?
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Split meetings for smaller WGs, review teams,
EPDP, etc., can probably be handled in a had-hoc
manner given the constraints and situation of
individual participants. And I can think that in
such cases, it could work.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Generally, it's not clear to me that actual
issues have been identified, besides the general
feeling that the community wants more clarity on
what's going to happen. I do not feel that the
questions we have received from ICANN Org would
allow them to actually identify the variety and
category of issues members of the community may be
foreseeably facing, now and in the future. There
is a major difference in providing solutions for
people who are <i>unwilling </i>to travel/attend a
public meeting vs people who are <i>unable </i>to
travel/attend a public meeting. And right now I
have no idea how many people may be facing a given
issue, and how does this map into stakeholder
groups, SO/ACs, etc. And from what I read, I don't
feel that Org knows either. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Take the "concern" that some participants may
have more limited financial means, in the current
circumstances or generally. Providing a regional
hub (according to what regionalization scheme
also? ICANN's own or something else?) as a
solution assumes a certain pattern of flight
prices (which may or may not be true in various
places around the world) and it assumes that
participants are somewhat both unable and
unwilling to travel further, rather than just
unable. If money only is the issue, then improving
travel support is the solution, not splitting
meetings into regions.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>As for hybrid in the sense of both in
person and remote, I suppose that's what we've
been having for a while now, and yes there
needs to be improvements as to how things are
done. Remote participation needs to be
engaging; there's plenty of people around
who've been thinking about that, inside and
outside of ICANN. Making remote participation
engaging has become somewhat of a
widespread problem! If we have people among us
(NCSG) who have specific knowledge on that, I
think it would be great if they could come
forward. But it's also Org's duty to do its
homework and look into that. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Have a nice day,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Jun 13,
2020 at 8:45 AM Stephanie E Perrin <<a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" moz-do-not-send="true">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px
0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p>Thanks for forwarding Rafik! Interesting,
but a bit sketchy on details. I foresee
travel problems for a long time, and would
think that regional hubs could achieve better
participation....seems to be included in the
hybrid model, but without costed models we
really can't tell how much is feasible. I
think it would be very helpful if members
could think about what their own situations
are likely to be in 6months to a year, and
where they would be willing or able to travel
to. Borders will definitely still be barred
to some regions, I am betting, and we need to
ensure that our global membership is not
disproportionately impacted. <br>
</p>
<p>Please note that the fall meeting will be
virtual again, and we need to think hard about
how to enliven and enrich that meeting, as it
is the annual general meeting and normally a
big one. We should tune in to that June 25
plenary session, where these issues will be
discussed.</p>
<p>Stephanie Perrin</p>
<p>NCSG Chair<br>
</p>
<div>On 2020-06-12 8:51 p.m., Rafik Dammak
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">hi all,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Please find attached draft proposal on
how to return to face to face meetings on
phases from ICANN, put for review and
input. It was already decided that ICANN69
will also be a virtual meeting <a onclick="return checkLinkHref(this.href);" target="_blank" href="https://www.icann.org/news/announcement-2020-06-11-en" moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.icann.org/news/announcement-2020-06-11-en</a>.</div>
<div>You can share your comments and
feedback on this thread.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Best Regards,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Rafik<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">----------
Forwarded message ---------<br>
<br>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<div lang="EN-US">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">Dear
SOAC Chairs and Vice-Chairs:</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">An
action item from your 18 May
call with Goran, where you
discussed the idea of a phased
return to large face-to-face
meetings, was for ICANN Org to
prepare a draft of what such an
approach might look like. I am
pleased to attach a draft
proposal that we believe is
feasible and prudent approach.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">Goran
and I hope that you will share
the draft with your community
groups as we are eager to hear
the community’s views and
feedback on what we have
described in the paper. Goran
will also touch on the various
elements outlined in the draft
approach during the third
ICANN68 plenary session
scheduled for 25 June, on
Advancing Policy Work in the
Current Environment. The
Community can provide some
initial comments at that session
and we will follow up with
further conversations during our
next Planning Meeting for
ICANN69.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">I
will be sending you a separate
email about the third ICANN68
plenary session scheduled for 25
June, on Advancing Policy Work
in the Current Environment.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">We
hope to hear your and your
communities' views after you
have had a chance to discuss the
draft. We will be happy to
organize a call after ICANN68
for this purpose.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">Thank
you again for your time and
participation on these calls and
Roundtables, both physical and
virtual.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">Best
regards,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">David</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">David
A. Olive<br>
Senior Vice President</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">Policy
Development Support</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">Internet
Corporation for Assigned Names
and Numbers (ICANN)</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;color:black">Washington,
D.C.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt"> </span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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-- <br>
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<div><b><i>Bruna Martins dos Santos </i></b></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>Skype ID: bruna.martinsantos<br>
</div>
<div>@boomartins<br>
</div>
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