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The reminder (Avri claims it is only a reminder) is very important
IMO. <br>
<br>
I can not attest to have experience in treaty/bylaws/whatever
negotiations, but i do have a small experience with collective
bargaining labor agreements (and follow ups of real life impacts of
such small changes in CLAs) and i can assure you that reminders and
redundancies (or lack thereof) are righfully so a major area of
contention. Rightfully so because you can be certain that parties
behaviors post CBA will be to go ahead and act as if the absence of
reminder is a permission to go ahead and you are thus buying
yourself a conflict in the future. <br>
<br>
I'm thinking this is even more the case in bargaining such that you
guys are involved into. Also, those that say "deal breaker" all the
time must be met with absolute resolve. To force them to "deal
break" on that seemingly tiny issue is the best course of action.
But you guys are dealing with multiple players and interests so you
have exponentially more fun ;)<br>
<br>
My .02<br>
<br>
Nicolas<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2015-08-04 11:02 AM, Robin Gross
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:E19DEDEB-E2CD-4ACB-9F2E-6DDF0618824F@ipjustice.org"
type="cite"><base href="x-msg://7685/">There was considerable
pushback from the GNSO on this, but the GAC played the "we'll
reject the plan if you don't give us what we want" card and too
many in the GNSO are desperate for a "transition" at any costs and
were afraid of anything slowing down the process. So those who
were willing to say "this is a deal-breaker for us" could pretty
much get what they wanted.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Robin</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Aug 3, 2015, at 7:04 PM, Mueller, Milton L wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span"
style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: Helvetica;
font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal;
orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none;
-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width:
0px; font-size: medium; ">
<div link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72" lang="EN-US">
<div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1; ">
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">I
repeat what I said to Avri. ICANN’s mission and
core values speak to, and are supposed to bind,
ICANN – not GAC. By altering the language in the
way you did, you let ICANN off the hook, not GAC.<o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family:
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">--MM<o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><a moz-do-not-send="true"
name="_MailEndCompose"><span style="font-size:
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></a></div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><b><span style="font-size: 11pt;
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri,
sans-serif; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>NCSG-Discuss
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU">mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU</a>]<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On
Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Edward
Morris<br>
<b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Monday,
August 3, 2015 8:15 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration:
underline; ">NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
[NCSG-Discuss] CCWG Accountability Report is Now
Out<o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div>
<div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 9pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif; ">The government's were very
sensitive about any encroachment upon their
defined GAC territory or any attempt to
interfere with their independence, the debate
over stress test 18 (consensus within GAC) being
the principal example. My recollection is that
Spain and Brazil were the most vocal demanding
the changes you mention, Milton. As Avri has
conveyed, governments felt it was the Board's
responsibility to determine compliance with the
Bylaws, not theirs.<o:p></o:p></span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 9pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif; "> <o:p></o:p></span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 9pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif; ">Ed<o:p></o:p></span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 9pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif; "> <o:p></o:p></span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 9pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif; "> <o:p></o:p></span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 9pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif; "> <o:p></o:p></span></div>
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top: 0in;
margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom:
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New
Roman', serif; text-align: center; " align="center"><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial,
sans-serif; ">
<hr align="center" size="2" width="100%"></span></div>
<div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; ">From</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma,
sans-serif; ">: "Avri Doria" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:avri@ACM.ORG" style="color:
rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration: underline; ">avri@ACM.ORG</a>><br>
<b>Sent</b>: Tuesday, August 4, 2015 12:27 AM<br>
<b>To</b>:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193);
text-decoration: underline; ">NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU</a><br>
<b>Subject</b>: Re: CCWG Accountability Report
is Now Out</span><span style="font-size: 9pt;
font-family: Arial, sans-serif; "><o:p></o:p></span></div>
<div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 9pt;
font-family: Arial, sans-serif; "> <o:p></o:p></span></div>
</div>
<div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in;
margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt;
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman',
serif; "><span style="font-size: 9pt; font-family:
Arial, sans-serif; ">Hi,<br>
<br>
The point was that the Board is responsible for
making sure the advice<br>
it accepts is consistent with the bylaws. GAC
does not accept that<br>
responsibility. Then again, I know of no other
ACSO that is making that<br>
decsion of whether their recommendations or
advice are consistent with<br>
the bylaws.. It is up to the Board, and the the
IRP to decide whether<br>
something is consistent with the bylaws. That is
their job.<br>
<br>
As for whether it is a bad as it looks to you,
probably not.<br>
<br>
avri<br>
<br>
<br>
On 03-Aug-15 19:00, Mueller, Milton L wrote:<br>
><br>
> Robin and other fellow NCSG-ers:<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Regarding human rights, I have been going
through the CCWG report and<br>
> found something very disturbing.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> On page 33, which is part of the section on
“Principles” I noticed a<br>
> big loophole opening up in the attempt to
constrain ICANN’s actions by<br>
> defining a limited mission. Paragraph 224
has been modified in a way<br>
> that makes it LESS restrictive than before.
It says that ICANN must<br>
> take into account advice of governments,
and the former language about<br>
> how the advice must be consistent with its
bylaws and its fundamental<br>
> commitments and core values has been struck
out.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Can anyone who was in Paris tell me how
this happened and whether it<br>
> really is as bad as it looks?<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> *From:*NCSG-Discuss [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193);
text-decoration: underline; ">mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU</a>]
*On Behalf<br>
> Of *Robin Gross<br>
> *Sent:* Monday, August 3, 2015 5:06 PM<br>
> *To:*<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU"
style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193);
text-decoration: underline; ">NCSG-DISCUSS@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU</a><br>
> *Subject:* [NCSG-Discuss] CCWG
Accountability Report is Now Out<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> The CCWG-Accountability report is out:<br>
><br>
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://bit.ly/1IUzwJB" style="color:
rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration: underline; ">http://bit.ly/1IUzwJB</a><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://t.co/5nYZyX5nII" style="color:
rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration: underline; ">http://t.co/5nYZyX5nII</a>><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> One important and positive recommendation
is the report is that ICANN<br>
> include a commitment to human rights in its
bylaws. But there's a lot<br>
> of other significant changes in there, so
please read the report.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> NCSG will have a webinar on 5 August to go
over this report and have<br>
> any discussion on it participants want.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> The comment period is now for 40 days.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Thanks,<br>
><br>
> Robin<br>
><br>
<br>
<br>
---<br>
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</div>
</div>
</span></blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
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